Unfortunately we need some kind of government. If there is no government or politic's, no-one is gonna protect us against eachother.

That's the sad truth about our species....we are beasts just as any other animal, yet we have the possibility to tame ourselves through the tribes we're part of.

The difference between a liberal and an anarchist is that the liberal knows this and will thus be in favor of the least totalitarian regime where the anarchist thinks he can live in the absence of any regime.

Now the sad thing is that our democratic system allows half of our population, who're imbiciles, to have a say in not just where their own lives should be going, but where society as a whole should be going as well.

My solution is realy very simple: say yes to the system and openly obey it's rules, while, once in the privacy of your own house, just do whatever you like regardless of what the system says you should do.

I agree with you. There are republicans that have shown to be wise and moderate people. I've always had a great respect for john mcain for instance. But you can clearly see that people within the party have put a great deal of pressure on him to make a move to the right.

So there may be many very decent and wise republicans, the party on the whole is very much influenced by radical rightwing elements within it.

Although the party tries to present itself as being for 'the man on the street'/ 'joe the plumber' or whatever you call the average american, it's clearly a party that purely serves the interest of the rich people. I find the former president george bush and future presidential candidate palin both the embodyment of this peculiar trait. They're both very rich people who never worked a day in their lives and they're all for tax cut's for the richest people. Under george bush the richest few people in america actually did get their lower taxes, costing the state billions of dollars, while the average americans where paying for this luxury, because you got to get your revenues from somewhere, not?

The party is also definately the least liberal of the two major party's. There isn't likely ever to come a republican administration that will be in favor of your right to die in dignity if you ever get a serious illness for instance and the war on drugs isn't likely to end or even to lessen, under a republican administration either, to name a few points.
If you would want those things to get realised, you have more chances of seeing them come true under a democratic president.

But what i most of all agree on with you, is that the hate that's being cultivated and fostered against people with slightly different political views in our society's is becoming more and more distructive.

In the houses of parliament of all the major western countries, politicians are busier fighting eachother and frustrating the interests of eachothers electorate, than to genuinely serve the interest of all the people.

I don't see this changing soon and therefore our society's are probably not capable of responding to real crisis, since they're not capable of responding to even small issues in the first place.

Politic's is exactly like shakespeare describes it, but in 99.9999% of the cases unfortunately somewhat less poetic.

the lunacy of religious nutcases and their role in public policy continues....today there's a story on Yahoo about some SOuthernBaptist preacher who contends hatha yoga is of the devil. Just like what the Taliban and Egyptian Brotherhood have said about it! Well, you gotta hand it to this guy, just like the archetypical 19th century snake oil salesman, he's obviously figured out a totally legal way of conning the people in his congregation into supporting his miserable little life and as a result doesn't have to hold a real job. IMHO, of course.

Unless, of course, he's secretly working for the CIA in order to INFILTRATE the Taliban!

As for those of you who don't vote: at least if you vote you have a say in which liar gets the privilege of robbing you. Oh wait, I get it now, why would that even matter!?!?!

I disagree with your assessment of liberalism. from my angle, when liberals are in power the size of the government grows. The depth that it reaches into your personal life is increased as well. I feel that liberals look at that "other half" you mentioned and decide that they are too dumb to know whats good for themselves. Then they push through laws and taxes to modify the behaviors.



The problem is that there are "imbeciles" on both sides that can be easily swayed by hot topics and repetitive -news- casts.



The days of being able to stick your head in the sand will come to an end one day. The only reason you still have the option is that there are people who care about your (and their own) freedoms enough to be an activist and advocate for them.

Voting now is more important than ever! Get the con artist Republicans and Democrats out of power, bring the power to the masses and not the media.

"Either your a part of the problem or a part of the solution. What's your contribution to life?"
Jurassic 5

Voting is so important right now. If pot gets legalized in California then a significant portion of the population will start seeing the government with greater respect for their newfound common sense. This includes everyone from state-heads on down to policemen because they are the manifestation of the legal organization. Results of the respect and economic growth could ripple out to other states letting them consider legalization. Next realistic laws that benefit humanity could even spread to THE WORLD!

Seriously if you live in California please register to vote and TAKE CARE OF THIS SHIT!

I don't stick my head in the sand. I just happen to believe that our civilisation is lost already, so every attempt to change anything is destined to fail.
If i would believe i could change anything, i would do whatever it takes.

In my country, an egotistic racist who wants to destroy everything and hurt people, has just become the most powerfull figure of the newly formed government. I don't see how i could have any hope left for the insignificant shitty piece of shit holland has become.

And secondly, if a democratic system eventually leads to an inferiour government, than apparently the democratic system is inferiour. How could a system that's not inferiour by itself, result into something that's inferiour if the sole purpose of the system is the results it brings?

lol.."get out there and vote!"...

Seriousily.."democracy" is like a shitty slogan they try to sell to children on the back of a cereal box..while they eat all that crap right out of the palm of they're greedy hands..sorry, but when I look back and see how, decade after decade a system that gives me the the choice of one lying asshole over another has continuousily failed us, I start to think in terms of alternatives....why bash your head into the same wall multiple times?

"Either your a part of the problem or a part of the solution. What's your contribution to life?"

So?...why does that have to be specifically relative to voting? Why is voting the ONLY way to be a "part of the solution"?

All it is is you saying " I want this", to some strangers who most likey dont give a shit about you or the welfare of your family..and they have had more than enough time to prove this to us..

Il vote for love and poetry, art and elegance, good taste, higher sense and realization to save us at this point over some preaty face on a ballet..Im not even sure I would bother to save a system that cant rise up to that level of cultural sophistication without the illusion of a "leader" doing all that for them...Its a sad sad fucking hole we have ourselves dug into here..the game playing of musical chairs by those who choose to follow another into THEY'RE story is something I never EVER want to be a part of.

Forget about these silly games that spin us in circles..that dance is sooo ugly and we are running out of cards left to play. Live you own story and start living it today. If the plot to your story revolves around playing a silly game called follow the leader then good luck with that. Mine sure as hell doesnt.

As long as you play by the rules of the leader you will ALWAYS be nothing more than a cog in THEY"RE machine..dont you want to be something greater than that in a machine of your own creation?

This thread brought up some old memories of someone who I have sat down with a few times over the years, gotten very stoned and listened to..
http://www.youtube.com/w...GYVg&feature=related

I think he was the first one who really brought up the idea for me that wat we needed in order to even ever have anything close to a democracy, is have some sort of option on the ballet for people who feel that the entire party system is flawed and hae no desire to have to choose between a limited group of individuals that lack any single impressive traits at all..why should I have to either vote for 1 person out of, say 4 candidatesm when I really just feel like im being forced into choosing the more appealing bully out of of the lot of them?..why shouldn't I have my own honest say on the whole matter registered and (hopefully) concidered? If I cant at least have that (as a start), then how is that "democracy"?

http://www.rainbowcoalition.ca/BALLOT.HTM

I don't quite follow. What is your alternative?

I think yes... This stuff has shown me the capacity to change your beleifs and principles; and certainly the people surrounding it do...

In my state, voters always have the option of choosing a “write-in” candidate. There is a blank entry, and the voter can put whatever he wants on that line. We are not forced to choose from the pre-printed candidates only. I’ve always assumed that ballots are like this everywhere?

The biggest flaws of any democratic system is that people can choose between different views on the world. This suggests that all views are equal, it denies that some things are true and some things are not true.

Maybe a panel of scientists should first weigh every program people can vote for and erase everything that's bullshit.
Every program that would lead to a budget deficit that's too big to keep the economy in balance, every policy that's based on false assumptions (DMT is a killer drug, homosexuals are a danger to family life, GMO-crops are dangerous to the environment, etc.) should just be erased.

Ofcourse some people will call this totalitarian, but that's a childish way of looking at it: we don't have the freedom to decide for ourselves what's true and what isn't. For instance, we don't have the freedom to decide that houseprices will always go up. Just assuming something without carefull considerations leads to accidents, some of wich can be fatal. Eventually the world is the way it is and it doesn't give a shit about our opinions.
If you'd think this is totalitarian, than you must think the truth is totalitarian and you should blame the world for not answering our wishes and desires.

We also have the ability to Write In. I'm pretty sure that is a federal thing (USA).
You never have to support the establishment Dem or Rep. My personal voice is Libertarian but their are others. We won't win anytime soon but we are collectively establishing a voice. If we rally, vote, participate in the faulty system eventually we will be heard. Staying at home posting on a forum your discontent will guarantee you won't make a change. The establishment wants you to do nothing, which is exactly why we need to exercise our rights while we still have them.

I like the new idea but personally I don't think it will work for one big reason.
Scientist, like anyone, have been proven to be swayed by the all mighty $$$. Even panels can be bought by power and money. So all power is actually being striped from the masses (you & I) and given to those with $$$ (government).

Personally I feel that would make matters worse. The power needs to be in the hands of the people and not the governments.

It's just going to take a mass awakening in consciousness, and that's it. End/Beginning of story.

For the libertarians:

Ron Paul and Gary Johnson are a couple of libertarians in the Grand Olde Party. Republicans and Democrats are the only ones to win the elections, so pushing liberty-oriented candidates through the primaries is probably the best shot.

We won't all wake up at once. Those of us that awaken first will need to rouse the others.