dont know if you heard this yet
but there is a guy being charged for 32 dollor worth of salvia
there trying put him away for 20 years
he got it of ebay

Salvia is legal in most parts of the world. Where did that happen?

DAMN! Betta not be the USA!

Found the story here:
http://www.yelp.com/topi...may-mean-years-in-prison

Another case of freightened people voting on the wrong politicians...

This is horrible. Salvia was also banned in germany a couple of months ago. It's definatly a trend.

that is a real shame. this guy should try to defend himself as hard as he can.

whats with people and this mentality that drugs need to be illegal to protect our children? how about parent's need to wake up and talk to their kids about drugs? or schools need to educate children on their dangers and benefits. this kind of thing makes me want to puke on a police officer.

The whole system makes no sense at all. What about alcohol, tobacco, and coffee? Those are also drugs.

According to all animal tests caffeine is as toxic as bufotenine, and yet bufotenine is illegal in some countries while coffee is not.

Tobacco kills people all the time by causing cancer, is extremely addictive, and yet it’s legal in nearly every country in the world.

And then there’s alcohol. All around the world people die from binge drinking alcohol at parties. See this “Alcohol-related fatalities among British adults doubled from 4,144 in 1991 to 8,758 in 2006”. That’s a very destructive and potentially lethal drug. Alcohol ruins more people than any other drug and yet its legal almost everywhere.

No one has ever died from taking DMT, 5-MeO-DMT, bufotenine, LSD, psilocin, mescaline, etc.!

Most drug policies around the world make absolutely no sense at all.

Go figure!

There's just no need to even talk about it anymore dude.

I'm so sick of it! People are fucking stupid, brianwashed, dumbasses, PERIOD.

Yeah. Well, we should all do our best to re-brainwash re-program all those idiots out there. If they can be brainwashed by society to believe such nonsense then they can be re-brainwashed using scientific data. It's just a matter of getting the real factual information out there to out flood all the bullshit. The internet is a good tool for this.

I always do my best to convince others about how beneficial psychedelics are to human beings. It's far more beneficial to take a psychedelic than to get drunk, and much safer health wise. Science has all the numbers to back up that. It is not a claim. It is a fact that even LSD is safer and less damaging than alcohol. The ratio between a lethal dose of alcohol and the threshold dose of alcohol is many times smaller then that of LSD. LSD has an extremely large safety scale.

Yeah, like 1 person jumped out of a window on LSD back in the 60’s and that made the headlines and no one has forgotten that. But do you know how many people kill themselves by jumping off of bridges while drunk! That number is in the millions now.

When you look at the total number of deaths cause by alcohol from toxic poisoning, suicides, drunk driving, etc., it’s millions of times more than all the deaths caused by all the drugs around the entire world. It’s a major drug and continue causing damage to humans around the globe and yet people focus on things like salvia. It makes absolutely no sense.

GET THE WORD OUT THERE! CONVINCE OTHERS WITH THE FACTS!

Don’t let some idiot politician somewhere decide what you can and can’t ingest into your body. Get the laws changed. FORCE IT TO HAPPEN. Be active.

Together we can get the laws changed. We need to be very vocal about it and not give in at all.

I here ya... I but I also enjoy having a life, I just feel like... It's not my task to make people smarter.

I agree w/ you 100% 69ron but "they" Corperate Amarica (which really contolls the govt),wants people puffing on carcinogens and all jacked up on caffeine because it means corperate profits.

Freeing ones mind and soul from the chains of earthly possesions (mabey i went a little far there) and enlightenment through the use of psychedelics does not help corperate america and they know it.Which is why the mandatory minimum (jail sentence) is much,much greater for LSD than it is for cocaine (which has caused plenty of deaths).
After Albert Hoffman concocted LSD 25,it was one of the biggest things to hit science and there was much excitement amongst the scientific community and all sorts of experiments were being done on its benefits.

One example is the discovery of the double-helix DNA strand,which francis crick deduced under the influence of LSD.Has anyone ever seen waht looks like dna strands,while on dmt???

We all know that there are major benefits not only to science but humanity at large in the use of ethneogens but as long as it threatens corperate america and our governments bullshit policies they will do their damndest to keep us underground.

With all the scientific benefits and things they were learning about the human brain to put an abrupt stop to psychedelic research with LSD and make it a schedule 1 narcotic,one has to ask themselves;what the fuck?
But they blaimed it on timothy leary and the haight ashbury scene which was getting out of controll.

I think tim leary fucked it up for a lot of people doing legitimate research on lsd?
Now we have all these little MTV brats at keg parties filming little jimmy trying salvia 20x for the first time and everyone laughing at him. Things are fucked up.

All one can do is spread "the word,lead by example and be as responsible as you can be without attracting unwanted attention.which is happening w/ salvia (not that i really like salvia).
There looking to make an example of this poor guy,when they were there looking for his son.They want to spread fear that the same thing can happen to you.
I'ts not my job the save the world but if i can turn one person on to a new way of thinking,i'll be happy.

I've always though it is funny how people are trained to demonize certain drugs over others.

For instance, you could take a video of a clearly non-sober person trashing his apartment, screaming at people, and exhibiting generally destructive behavior. Then show that video to people and their reactions will depend mostly on what they think they person ingested to obtain that state of mind.

Tell them it is salvia (or another little-known drug) and they say, "Wow, that's what salvia does? We should make that stuff illegal so no one ever ends up like that."

However, tell them it's alcohol and they say, "Wow, that person really needs to exhibit some self-control and not abuse alcohol to such a degree." If people suggest making alcohol illegal then they aren't taken seriously, but if it is something else then the reaction is generally "yea, that makes sense."



This is one of those subjects that is more complex than most people care to understand. People want to know "is this drug bad or is it good?"... saying "well, it is bad if you use it a certain way, but it is beneficial when used responsibly under these conditions, etc etc" exceeds their attention spans. The people who take the time to understand the issue fully end up being the minority, so even if they end up in a position to affect laws, they end up not getting elected due to being "pro-drugs".

Personally I'm looking forward to the development of computers that surpass the intelligence of humans. Our social structures are getting way too complex for the average person to even begin to understand, but that is a whole other discussion all together (even though it will probably happen within our lifetimes).

I really like that argument.

Not really run by computers... it's a complex issue. I'll start another thread here is a little while when I get a chance to type up something a little more informative (at work currently).


Edit: I wrote a post about this in the Tech forum if anyone wants to check it out and have a discussion about it: http://www.dmt-nexus.me/...s&m=17998&#17998

=)

For many people, mind altering substances represent an alternative lifestyle. They would rather want to forbid the alternative ideas and perceptions on life that these hippies have, but since in the western world you can't do this (it ain't china everywhere), they go for the second best thing; to forbid everything assosciated with this alternative lifestyle.
People fear everything that (they feel) is different. The reason they fear everything that looks different, is that it is NOT that different when you take a second look. After all, people fear mostly all that they reject in themselves. All of us, at the end have the talents to be both agressive as submersive, obedient as rebelious, etc. This causes constant internal upheaval and restlesness, since it conflicts with the simple picture we tend to have of ourselves (budhists call this thing 'ego'. This process is the main motivator for all political engagement in most people and the main reason why most people on earth have immediate opinions on any topic reached on to them, even if they don't know anything concerning the contend of this topic. You could clearly see this in relation with the war in iraq on wich virtually every human being had the strongest convictions, most of them being absolutely ridiculous (varying from:"shock and awe, will causse a worldwide cascade of pro-american democratization", to "the bush administration is in a brilliant but evil manner acting out a carefully thought through and subtle plan to gain control over iraq's oil wells".
Any politisized subject, mind altering substances being unfortunately one of them, is destined to get crushed in this psychological mechanism. Strongly convicting all that we judge in ourselves helps us to believe we are indeed our 'ego', and it helps to bind the groups of people with the same attitude towards life.
We can only become the exception to this if we start to celebrate how internally fucked up we are and treat the war against drugs as if it is just an unfortunate circumstance, like a bird accidentaly dropping shit on us.

polytrip, you definately have an intersting way of stating things and getting your point across that i admire.

I think you and i are pretty much saying the same thing,which that the u.s govt likes to pull the wool over peoples eyes.They dont want people taking mind expanding ethneogens that might cause people to actually question idiocracy.

They are going to probably try and make this poor guy an example and instill the fear (which is one of there greatest weapons) that the same thing will happen to you if you posses this natural growing leaf.

I like to drink every now and then,i'll have a glass of wine w/ dinner or a bear or two after work (not every day) and very rarely i will get shit faced if i happen to go out with friends but alcohol makes people act dumb and dangerous,becuase of poor judgement.I guess it is more socially acceptable to use a substance that causes automobile accdents,drunken fights and just sheer stupidity than it is to take an inward jouney.

Our government wants us to be stupid and sheepish and they do this through the media's sensationalism of creating fear and many other ways of keeping us in line,so the few can stay rich and powerfull.

Weapons of mass deception.

what's the death toll over there now?How much tax payer money has been spent on this war. It's a facade gone wrong.

Anyway i think i'm gonna go to sleep now.Goodnight all

I am so happy that I don't live in the USA. I think it is the most hypocrit country in the world. 'Land of the free' hahaha yeah right...

It is the most 'unfree' western country that I know of.

As for the main question: drugs shouldn't all be made legal BUT it should be depenalized like weed in holland (which is a 30m drive from where I live) and give the people information about drugs. It also should be clear for everyone that the standard cautions (like don't drink and drive) should also be used for drugs.

If drugs would be made completely legal IHMO then it also would be less fun because it wouldn't be exclusive anymore. Do you think it would be fun talking to your neighbour monday morning about their inner journey from last night? People whose minds aren't ready to trip? Most people that do psychedelic drugs are the cream of the crop, they want to learn something or just make fun, your average neighbour is not like you. Keep the differences, that's what life is all about...

I think that drugs are not for everyone...

For many substances, i don't think it's such a big loss that they're illegal. I wouldn't want crack cocaine or crystal-meth to become as widely available as alcohol or cigarettes. I even doubt wether alcohol or cigarettes should be as widely available as alcohol or cigarettes, sometimes. In most countries, marihuana is already half-legal in the sense that the cops don't chase people who use the stuff.
i think alcoholism or addiction to any substance is in the first place a dissease and in some cases it's a dissease that affects non-users as well, as with drunk drivers or people getting totally fucked up on the stimulants that make them feel that they're superman and the CIA is tapping their thoughts with some implant chip device, because everybody is against them.

'Land of the free' indeed! What about their history of slavery! What about the fact that the government can seize your land and take your home away in many states there if a large corporation wants your land! The USA hasn't been the land of the free for hundreds of years!

It’s only 'Land of the free' if you’re a large corporation able to buy off the politicians. No one else has true freedom there. All of the Americas south of the border have much more freedom than the USA does. But the large corporations love the USA because it is so money oriented and the people there are willing to work like slaves because they love money so much. South of the border, people don’t care that much about money, they mostly care about family and friends. That’s why the economies are not doing so well. The people just don’t care about money. In the US money is like a GOD. It is practically worshipped. In the USA you are almost solely judged by how much money you make.

freedom is a word each person seems to use in his own advance, lately. Especialy a guy like W seems to have an odd definition of the word. But i have nothing against americans, or at least i think we europeans are not that much better, generally speaking. I don't believe a majority of the americans would aprove of the ideology held by W, if they knew what he was realy thinking. Basically i just think americans are a little naïve about their own government. They probably think that things like for instance, revealing the identity of this CIA agent, is just an accident instead of seeïng a pattern in the beheviour of republicans, from watergate and al the lying to this one. The republicans don't have any moral limit they hold for themselves, many for the rest of the world, but even the laws they say they respect, are not an obstacle for them. They would kill if they could get away with it. I think most americans don't condone this, they just think "our government wouldn't do those kind of things". Ít's just naïve. And evilminded sick bastards like W take advantage of this naïvity, not to mention this fucked-up, psychopathic criminal carl rove. If he wouldn't be working for the GOP he would have spend the last 20 years in prison.