So if one was planning on making changa and has a decent amount of DMT N-Oxide from his first pull is it possible ot make changa with it? or would this not be such a great idea? Anyone have any experience with this?

Sure thing man, enhance that leaf.

Ive never enhanced with oxide but I see no reason for this not to work.

what makes you think its oxide?

but yes, theoretically even if its oxide it would work

...Turned out not to be oxide after all!!! After letting it dry it never turned to goo, and once chopped it easily powdered up. I thought it was oxide because sometimes I've done batches that leace high amounts of yellow goo afterwards, this gooey looking stuff dried up and is actually real good crystals...just off white....

It just so happens that, I very recently made a batch of what I belive to me dmt oxide changa. Actually, what I did was cleaned an extremely filthy GVG and my glass spice bong with 99% IPA and I used this to infuse .5 grams of caapi leaf.

I am under the impression that the residue left behind in the GVG is n-oxide. Maybe I am wrong.

Well it worked well. I have had a couple of sessions with it and I must say I am impressed.

Not heavy on the visuals but very heavy body load and audio. Lots of alarm bells and whistles!

It is actually fotent for what it is.

lol

I could have infused an entire gram. Easily.

Is it normal for changa to be somewhat sticky? I used .25g of blue lotus extract, .25g of Calea, .1 G of marijuana (for a little more leafy substance since the lotus extract is powdered), and .5g DMT.... All the alcohol is evapped from the dish but im letting it sit for another day to let make sure it all dissolved.

If you mix n-oxide with leaves maybe the carbon in the leaves absorbs the oxygen when they burn so you get purer N,N-DMT in your system. What do the chemists here say about that? I feel n-oxide works very well when mixed with mint leaves that shouldn't affect the experience. But it feels like it does.

Nah, the leaves do not have any more free carbon than the n-oxide itself. And even if they did, you cannot reduce n-oxide with carbon!

not to beat on this issue again but, even if it was yellow or goo, how do you guys know it is n-oxide in the first place? Yellow can be other impurities too that have no relation to n-oxide. Or, pure DMT can be an oil too, depending how it is (or isnt) crystallized. I think people are too quick to give names or to judge alkaloid content by the looks, which is obviously a very flawed way of judging.

I also wonder if people could tell n-oxide from pure dmt in a blind test.... I would guess not, but I would love if someone tested this.

I once had DMT that was not in an airtight container for over a year. It became very oily and then I was going to try and re-crystalize it but it didn't work. When I evaporated the solvent I was left with oily substance. I can only think that the DMT got oxidized. What else could have happen?

It could be all sorts of things, from decomposition to oxidation to oxidation specifically on the amine (i.e. the one that makes the n-oxide), most likely a combination of these things.

I used to smoke that on mint leaves. Quite potent but better for low doses. A bit on the chaotic side. I actually never broke through on that.

I love this type of debate! It's funny (almost scary) how people take simple observations or questionable assertions and spin them into facts after they've been repeated enough times. The N,N/N-oxide discussions are perfect examples.

Is it really possible to create pure DMT N-oxide by reacting H2O2 with N,N-DMT? Any chemistry experts know? If so, it seems like it would be very easy to test these theories. Maybe we could create a simple protocol and actually try to prove this with several independent experiments. Of course, double blind studies are beyond my capabilities so maybe it's not worth the effort after all . I'd be willing to give it a try because I'm very interested in the results and I'm sure I could scare up some white crystals to turn to n-oxide and some yellow oily goo for comparison.

-JM

For me when I smoke the yellow goo it seems to be longer lasting yet not as intense, a lot smoother if you will but definitely not easy to try to breakthrough on... Does that sound like oxide?

That sounds like the yellow goo I'm accustomed to, but there's some debate about whether the oily stuff is actually N-oxide or just N,N mixed with plant fats and oils. I'd love to know for sure!

yeah but you know its yellow goo.. placebo and self-suggestion are very important factors in the psychedelic experience. Thats why we need blind testing.

Sure you can do some blind testing, jmaxton. Just dissolve the different dmts in herbs, label the containers, mix them up without looking at the labels, get from one randomly (and take a picture without looking, so later you can see from which one you got). Smoke a few times over a few different days (and/or have some friends to try it randomly too) and compare the experience. The ideal is to have a ready kind of questionnaire or use something like a hallucinogen effects rating scale to fill up after being back. This would be really really good things to test and increase the knowledge of our community, but its rare that anybody gets the opportunity/time/will to do this.

jmaxton, I think I remember somebody in the forum (infundibulum?) talking about the possibility of considerable part of dmt still be intact when reacting with hydrogen peroxide, and only part oxidize, even if it became all oily. Would be wonderful if those few members with mass-spec/chromatography equipment to test.

I have a gram of freebase that was extracted over a year ago. It has turned a orange/brown colour which I presume is oxidation? It was off white.
Was thinking of making some changa with it as this is my preferred method of smoking the spice hence the reason the freebase has just sat there Un used for over a year. Do you think this will be good to smoke? Has it lost some potency and will it continue to degrade once turned to changa?

Even in that case, oxidation should be superficial, you possibly wont notice anything. Just treat as DMT and you`ll be fine

Thanks for the reply, I will knock up some caapi changa using the oxidised dmt and see what happens.