I smoked spice from a FOAF that was orange and powdery. It smelled like rubber or kinda like new sneakers and the vapor smelled like burnt new sneakers The trip consisted of extreme euphoria, massive visual distortions, fractal patterns and interlocking geometric shapes of light. My question was if you guys think this was N,N or 5-MeO?

Sounds like N,N to me.

Yes, that absolutely sounds like DMT. 5-MeO-DMT is not really visual and often produces dysphoria instead of euphoria. Actually 5-MeO-DMT is a compound vastly different than DMT, both bufotenin (5-OH-DMT) and psilocin (4-OH-DMT) is much closer to DMT in effect.

Massive visual distortions suggests NN DMT rather than 5 meo.......

I dunno..ive heard reports of crazy visuals from 5meo actaully..even that guy oroc himself in a you tube video talks about dragons flying all around the room when he opened his eyes.

But I bet it was DMT you smoked..unless someone specifically said it was 5meo.

Someone who didn't see it or have anything to do with it planted the idea in my head, but I wasn't sure.

My question now is what process throughout the extraction could have lead it to be such a solid rusty orange color. Cause I've seen white and yellow, but this was straight up orange.

Oroc is one of the only people who has claimed that he had strong visuals on 5-MeO-DMT. I don't know too much about him or his story but his effects sound much more inline with DMT to me than 5-MeO-DMT. Also I am not sure where or how he obtained his 5-MeO. In one video on his first experience he said a friend gave it to him or I think in another that he got it from the internet. So idk?

Many people I know have reported minimal visuals off of 5-MeO-DMT. Many psychonauts including Dennis McKenna, Terrence McKenna, DM Turner and others who likely had access to pure chemicals also make such claims. Terrence says the one thing I notice with 5-MeO-DMT is that "I am not hallucinating". Unfortunately Ott doesn't mention subjective effects at all in his investigations reported in his Errhines book making one claim that he felt the pharmacodynamics were similar to DMT taken as pharmahuasca. Not sure what this means? Check out the 5-MeO-DMT chapter in TIHKAL. A majority say no visuals or do not mention visuals at all in their reports. At a higher dose (15 mg) there is one claim of "subtle" colorful phosphenes and one other at 25 mg which suggests some visuals but they sound more like a dream. 25 mg is an insane dose btw.

It is possible that a subset of people do get visuals off of 5-MeO-DMT. I have gotten very weak minor visuals from higher doses occasionally. Like swirling patterns and such. However it has been my experience that most people do not seem to get strong visuals off of it. Never anywhere near the intensity of DMT visuals even from low dose DMT.

After reading his book Tryptamine palace I would guess if he is talking about 5-meo in that video it was 5-Meo. He knows the difference between the two. He was introduced to it by a friend when people were ordering synthesized 5-meo online from chemical companies. And other than that had some from the bufo Toad. He does a very good job explaining the dosages and to be SUPER SUPER careful with 5-meo since a full blown dose is in the 10-15mg range.

Mostly on 5-meo he talked about being contained in an all encompassing white light with fractal patterns without much visuals outside of that. However there may have been times where he had some visuals as well. I can't remember if he talked about the dragon's in the book and I don't think I saw that vid.

Hi Malaclypse



Threshold?

threshold is 3 mg for 5-MeO-DMT! YMMV of course, but for most people 3mg is threshold. I could never go over 12 mg. My soul screams in utter nothingness at that dose. It's the hardest thing I know. I cannot even imagine what 15 mg are

And not to contradict anyone, but 5-MeO IS occasionally visual. It is weird, because it does not have activity at the 5HT2a receptor. But there are occasionally visuals, sometimes at the intense coming up, others at the blissful state after the emptiness

Yeah sorry I meant full blown not threshold. Gonna edit the original and dig through my copy just to see what he had to say in case it is a lot higher than what erowid says.

Edit: Yeah he is a little on the higher side suggesting 12mg to someone starting, but at the same time commenting on his smoking method (which is NOT vaporizing but a glass pipe or bong with some herb as a bedding). He recommends to start of lower if vaporizing to where smoke can't escape. And always always always use new screens and wait at least 15 min between smoking in case some of it just melted. Since every mg counts this can be dangerous as he found out the hard way.

That's intimidating. I've not had the experience (and I doubt that I will, quite honestly), but I loved Tryptamine Palace. It's a mighty inspiring read.

Just to chime in here, these experiences are subjective... Smoked DMT never provides euphoria for me, until I'm starting to come back down. For me, my one 5-Meo-DMT smoked experience was INCREDIBLY euphoric, especially a few mins into the experience, like MDMA actually but very much deeper.

"Mostly on 5-meo he talked about being contained in an all encompassing white light with fractal patterns without much visuals outside of that. However there may have been times where he had some visuals as well. I can't remember if he talked about the dragon's in the book and I don't think I saw that vid."

Yep, this is VERY reminiscent of my experience. Being enveloped by a nebula/cloud of white light. There was some fractal imagery as well, but it had nothing on the all encompassing and very colourful visuals of smoked DMT. It was subtle and not colourful with the 5-Meo.

I might be a freak in this regard but I actually found 5-Meo a much more welcoming, warm, cosmic consciousness type experience than the often icy, annihilating experience of DMT. That's just me though. I would definitely like to explore the potentials of 5-Meo further.