I've prolly smoked my bufo changa about 6 times in joints and i've got the tingling in the back of the head but thats all i ever get!! so frustrating

Do you think most of the bufo is in 1 specific part of the changa maybe? or do you think i should try just smoking the rest of it til i get effects

how many g of seeds are you using, how are you extracting and how concentrated are you making it?..my entire batch of bufotenine changa that contains 12-15 doses would only make 1 not even large joint...

Sounds to me you arent smoking enough if all you feel is the tinglig..I use 40 seeds, thats about 6 grams..and I evap it onto less than 1 gram of leaf..with harmalas..thats 12-15 full doses for me. the stuff is always very dense and resiny, one littel bowl lasts about 5 hits, and 3 hits is all I can take then I lay down in the dark and have deep visions.

used about 30 grams i think. into about 1 gram of plant material i think (was a while ago).

Using about 100 mgs per joint. No effects at all.

Do you much prefer the bong/pipe route?

Its quite old now too... made it a few months ago. Will the changa have degraded at all?

ime - bufo left exposed all oxidizes within hours - the oxide is sickening and useless.

Bufotenine turns black after a while and is useless once that happens. SWIM had 98% PURE white bufotenine crystals go black even in an air tight sealed container after a few months. It’s either oxidizing or possibly becoming bufotenine carbonate? Whatever it is its nauseating and has almost no other effects. So it's not something you can save. It can be recovered though. SWIM tried doing a re-A/B on the black useless crap and recovered pure white bufotenine again with great effects as before.

This would be the same for changa yes? i left it out in the open for the evap process for quite a long time so that might explain alot. crap. I'm guessing it stays in teh seeds for a long period of time though yes?

No, many batches you can get are too old and therefore useless.

I don't think the bufotenine is lost. I think it's either bufotenine N-Oxide or more likely bufotenine carbonate that's forming.

Mescaline freebase eventually forms mescaline carbonate if left out in the open. It’s a solid, and very active. It can also form mescaline N-Oxide which is a reddish brown sticky mess, like most N-Oxides are, and that isn’t active according to SWIM’s tests. Bufotenine freebase has a similar pKa as mescaline, and so it probably also forms bufotenine carbonate when left out in the open.

I think more than likely the freebase bufotenine is forming bufotenine carbonate, which I believe is black, and that’s messing it up. The salts of bufotenine that SWIM tried are all unpleasant, not very visual at all, and bufotenine carbonate probably is too.

I don’t think it’s oxidizing. Bufotenine N-Oxide is very nauseating and sticky. You’ll feel like you were hit in the stomach if you smoke it. Yuck.

The seeds don’t contain freebase bufotenine, so they would not form bufotenine carbonate ever. But they do have bufotenine N-Oxide in them, and sometimes a lot. This is the main “toxin” present that makes you feel sick in the stomach. It’s a sticky substance and its presence often prevents bufotenine from crystallizing properly during extraction. Older seeds should have more bufotenine N-oxide as the seed ages. Bufotenine N-Oxide should take longer to form than bufotenine carbonate, unless it's very hot where you live.

Old black nearly inactive bufotenine can be renewed usually by dissolving it in acid and then freebasing it again. When dissolved in acid, it bubbles, just like when you add acid to sodium carbonate. This indicates to me that the old black bufotenine is bufotenine carbonate and not bufotenine N-Oxide. You can’t renew bufotenine N-Oxide by simply dissolving it in acid and freebasing again, you need to reduce it using zinc or something similar. But you can renew the old black bufotenine by dissolving in acid and freebasing it again.

Ron, out of curiosity, how do you know that the bufo seeds an N-oxide of bufotenine? To the best of mu knowledge whether the toxins in bufo are n-oxide has not been settled yet and it is just a theory/suggestion. In this respect, it would be a good idea to see some evidence for your claims.

Also, about mescaline n-oxide. I cannot find much info about it. How did SWIY make it, how did SWIY verify it and how did SWIY bioassay it? You understand that quite some proof needs to be presented you passing some claims around as a facts.

I hope you understand.

Yes I really want to know why people think bufotenin n oxide is forming and why perhaps bufotenin carbonate is forming. As far as I am aware there is considerable debate even if mescaline forms mescaline carbonate or not. Has this ever been demonstrated or published? Or is it just theorized?

It would be very simple to answer this question with some basic proton and carbon NMR experiments but thats not accessable to most people.

SWIM has analyzed 'tan' bufotenin by HPLC and there is always one compound and this material doesn't give SWIM good effects. Bufotenin has never given SWIM very good effects. N-oxides should differ from their parent freebases liquid chromatography as they do in thin layer chromatography. Maybe SWIM only had n oxide or maybe bufotenin just doesn't work well for certain people.

I think we should do more to get to the bottom of this whole n oxide mess even with dmt.

It would be easy. Take freebased dmt and freebased bufotenin. Make the n oxide with with hydrogen peroxide. See if you get a different spot on TLC or HPLC or whatever method one uses. Then reduce the material and see if it goes back to freebase.

If someone does that then this entire issue will be settled in one day.