This could possibly be a reason, SWIM has no experience to confirm this but at least two other members have noticed a difference. SWIM's toying with the possibility of, after an extraction yielding a salt, converting to freebase and pulling separately with heptane, then with acetone or IPA, keeping the heptane-produced product for vaporization and the IPA/acetone product to prepare a tincture. This could possibly be the best way to make full use of the extracts.



Limonene, my friend.

this is a fantastic thread which i have enjoyed following! thank you all who have contributed to it.

it is great to finally see a tek that does not burn the lungs or make some folks nauseous.

from what i understand in all the great posts here at the nexus, this can be made with 100% natural products
too. seems so promising as a method of administration! (can be totally green, less filling, taste great.......nice evolution!)

can anyone share if their experiences making the drops out of fumarate or freebase burns the skin inside
the mouth at all? is one better than the other? is the journey any different between the salt and freebase taken sublingually?

i already have fumarate and freebase and plan to make the drops asap.

just thought i would post to say thank you for this enlightenment and also to ask if there have been any new discoveries or breakthroughs.......from what i have read, i do think the idea of swallowing all drops right away to get the max coverage sounds like the way to go! (is that right?)

Still disappointing results after refining my sublingual technique. I'm convinced that there's something special in the full-range extract.

I tried administering 35mg of brick-colored harmine from the first base precipitation. I didn't have the intention to trip, but I just wanted to see whether it worked. I dissolved it in 0,5ml of 9% distilled vinegar and I put two drops at a time under my tongue. I couldn't manage to swallow the saliva that accumulated in my mouth without sucking the harmine juice along with it, so I alternated between letting the saliva accumulate elsewhere in my mouth than my sublingual region and swallowing the accumulated saliva in very small gulps.

I waited 20-30 minutes or so, without much effect, and then tried smoking some DMT. I inhaled a quantity that normally would only have resulted in a bit of intensified color and some relaxation. But the effects were considerably potentiated, to the point where I saw breathing textures, and lengthened maybe three or fourfold. And when I took another small hit, five minutes later, the effects cumulated, with no sensible tolerance.

But most interestingly, the character of the experience changed drastically. It was brought closer to a classic psychedelic experience than smoked DMT. It had a strong emotional and introspective dimension and also some stoned confusion, whereas on smoked DMT alone I feel totally sober and think normally. The visuals were more akin to mushrooms, wavy and undulating, than the super sharp and clear smoked DMT visuals, but without the intensification of detail and color that makes mushrooms beautiful.

The most interesing and potentially useful aspect was the utter vividness of the experience. The emotions and insights felt absolutely real, unlike other substances where they are more in the intellect and require subsequent integration with reality in the aftermath of the trip. This felt like the cleanest and most alive substance for introspection.

I'm going to take a full trip when I get around to it. But I'd also like to try THH if I can get my hands on some, to see if it preserves more of the clarity of DMT alone.

quick question, but does harmaline glycerin tinctures burn?

What size dropper bottle would you use/how much liquid is used for say one gram of dmt fumarates here?
Is there a good way of cleaning full range fumarates from a BLAB so that there is no fumaric acid in there?

IF you read the original tech (first page of this thread) thoroughly, not that I don't miss stuff too:


Production of Spice Tinctures
For Spice Acetate:
Add ~74mg/mL full-range freebase to the intended dropper bottle.
Dissolve in distilled white vinegar (5% acetic acid), converting to an acetate salt, by shaking vigorously and submerging in a hot-water bath.
Evaporate contents in a food-dehydrator at a temperature below 39°C, with the opened bottle stabilized as close to the fan as possible.
Refill with either vinegar (ensuring a pH of 4, at most) or 50% glycerin/water in order to preserve the contents to prevent spoiling and as a tincture of known concentration.
For Spice Fumarate:
Add ~86mg/mL full-range water-purified fumarates to the intended dropper bottle.
Dissolve in 50% glycerin/water, by shaking vigorously and submerging in a hot-water bath.
The resulting tincture will be ~66mg/mL of DMT and ~2.3mg/drop.

My Syrian Rue Harmala Tincture-- glycerin/water 50/50 does not burn at all, as compared to alcohol and vinegar.

After a bit of technique refinement, and the addition of a few hits of smoked DMT, I was able to get something quite fantastic from sublingual pharma.

Trip report was posted here.

Just popping in for some quick ideas that may have already been mentioned:

To get the most out of one's extract, take full range spice salts (fumarate, acetate, etc.), freebase in a paste, pull repeatedly with warm heptane and collect product from that however desired and set aside for smoking (SWIM prefers to evap on a dish and manually crystallize), then ensure the basified paste is dried and pull with anhydrous acetone or IPA, evap and dissolve in a tincture. SWIM likes to add his pipe cleanings to the tincture by evaping the IPA used to clean, dissolving the product in vinegar, filtering, reducing the volume, pouring into the dropper bottle, evaping the contents, and adding glycerin and water. Also, a tiny bit of mint oil seems to hasten absorption.

SWIM has performed extensive tests with the "leftovers" from heptane purification (as discussed above) and can confirm with full confidence, based on his own experience and that of four others, that the actives needed for a full mucosahuasca experience are contained in abundance. He has had a range of experiences, from dosing with a commercial harmaloid preparation (purportedly THH, but who knows) at the normal amount and a smaller amount of the spice in a somewhat public setting (a show) with satifactory and manageable effects, to dosing with a slightly impure home extract of rue and a heftier amount of spice, achieving one of his best huasca experiences, yet.

For the more recent stronger experience, he had ~1200mg of harmaloids (rue extract produced first by manske, then freebased, but still seemingly quite impure, appearance of dry mud flakes) stuffed into a 7.4mL dropper bottle, diluted with vinegar until sufficiently liquified, then further diluted with glycerine. The actual concentration of harmaloids was uncertain, so he guesstimated that he would need around three sets of five drops in a sitting. The concentration of the spice leftovers was also unclear, but he had been working with it in the past, so he settled on two sets of five drops, prepared to hold five more drops in reserve. The effects came on incredibly fast (10-15min?) and stuck it out for the normal 4-6hr duration, comprising magnificent tracers and visions. SWIM's certain that an extra five drops may have nailed him to the floor, but he ended up relaxed enough to make some music with only a minor struggle early on (partly from being a bit out of practice).

He'll be amending a process for obtaining and preparing the leftovers in his tek when he gets around to it. This is definitely the way to get the most out of one's extract. One idea for keeping track of how much spice a tincture contains would be to subtract the amount of spice pulled with heptane from the mass of the original product--much more appealing than weighing goo. The dosage would still likely need to be figured differently than with administering the full-range; probably quite a bit less, considering that pure DMT probably lends very little to this method.

SWIM'll be working on a method that would negate the need for storing tincture using the method of preparing and storing pre-prepared dosages here in conjunction with a way of saturating the smallest possible amount of vinegar with a single dose of spice and delivering the full dose by either dropper or spray-pump. He already has a very good idea of how this will be accomplished, but it'll be a while before he's able to experiment.

By the way, try the fumarate spray. Take a bunch...great "pick-me-up" from the darkest of the dark DMT.

What Fumarate Spray???
Thanks

Same as the tincture (as outlined in the wiki article in the OP) but using a nasal or throat spray bottle, either one sublingually, a few pumps at a time. There's info somewhere on the volume per pump but doing only a few at a time and allowing oneself to swallow between sets seems to be the way to go (absorption will still occur in the mouth and throat, despite swallowing, due to the small amount not being able to make it to the stomach). SWIM just put an estimated amount for two doses and engaged in a "pump, pump, pass" situation after "painting" the sublingual mucosa and gums with 40mg of harmaline. The spray is probably the best method for keeping folks from actually swallowing the bulk of the dose or diluting it in the mouth.

I was thinking about trying one of these for the spray idea?

Could someone please refresh me on the purpose of the Glycerin? Thanks...

I guess if this Atomizer holds 15 ml then I would need to figure out what one spray = equals?

And I guess I should get 2 one for each Harmalas/Spice respectively.

Looks alright. Is it just a normal pump operated spray bottle or a pressurized spritzer? SWIM was thinking a spritzer could be interesting.



Well, it should prevent spoiling, but it does enhance the taste slightly. SWIM's had instances where he's made up a tincture on the pot for immediate use of the total contents and only added a smidgen of glycerin for flavor. Also, try a tiny bit (perhaps just a drop, don't overdo it) of mint oil (extract for culinary purposes should work) to the mix to increase the rate of absorption.



It probably varies, this is why SWIM uses a nasal spray pump, as they tend to specify the volume or dosage delivered by each pump. It should be easy enough to test by spraying water into a measuring glass and comparing the number of pumps to the resulting volume delivered.



SWIM generally feels it may be more efficient to take the harmaloids first, though he follows it up almost immediately with the spice. An all in one mixture may work fine, but try it separately to be sure.


Remember to shake well before use!

Now you have me wondering if there is any technical difference between a so called "atomizer" and a regular spray bottle.
I'm guessing not.

I also found these here on the bay in 3 5 and 10 ml:

Actually I haven't really tasted spice spray but I can say Harmalas in water isn't that tasty.

So I guess flavor enhancement would be a good thing.

I just wondered if that much glycerin would effect the viscosity to the extent that it would effect the spray-ability.

Then of course there is the idea of adding even a very small amount of DMSO, just to enhance absorption...