My parents have been married for over 40 years and they are in their sixties. The past ten years they have been in retirement and their marriage has been having problems. My father has become verbally and on occasion physically abusive to my Mom and they are on the verge of divorce. My Dad has some deep seated issues stemming from his childhood that have made him controlling, hurtful to my Mom, and cruel. He readily admits that he behaves in a way that he is ashamed of, but says that he can’t control it.


Recently I told my Mom about my psychedelic usage and her reaction was one of surprise and fear. She knows these drugs have the potential to inflict harm if one goes down the rabbit hole too often, but she also knows that there are purported healing benefits associated with them too. Neither of my parents do drugs, they smoked weed a few times back in the 60s or 70s and that was it. When she called me today and said she wants my father to try a psychedelic, I thought he would be a perfect candidate to allow oral DMT to break down the barriers and walls that he has hidden behind in order to get some perspective on his cruel actions and behavior.


I gave him 100mg of Caapi Copy, 100mg of Syrian rue harmala alkaloids, and 106mg of yellow freebase DMT. Within fifteen minutes he was feeling strange and was soon writhing and jerking around on the bed, begging for it to stop. He was saying how this was the worst thing he ever did and how he wanted it to end. His eyes would open and glare and then he would shut them. He kept saying how he wanted to take a nap and this went on for an hour or so. Eventually he started apologizing for everything bad that he ever did and told us that he just wants everything to be perfect again. We went outside in the yard for a change of scenery, but this did little to calm him down. He was having a bad trip.


After a while we went on the couch and he began talking about his childhood, the marriage, and how he treats my Mom. I don’t know if any of this was new material for my Mom to hear, but at least he calmed down and was able to focus. I sat on the floor as my parents talked and had some laughs and some tender moments. I played their wedding song, Strangers in the Night, and it was pretty emotional. It was an experience.


Anyway, he says he will never do it again and that it was a terrible experience. He thinks we’re bunch of fucking nuts because we actually get pleasure from this crazy shit. I think that he did not like the loss of control, the loss of power. I think that he did not want to face some of the ideas that the DMT was trying to show him. He had no visuals, no euphoria, nothing pleasurable at all. Also, I think his total trip was only about two hours, and this is odd because my trips last five or six hours. He fought it tooth and nail. The physical reaction he had was kind of scary with all the writhing and jerking around. Anyway, I wonder if my Mom and I should try to get him to do it again in two weeks. Will more trips eventually break him down and make him face his demons? I don’t want him to have a heart attack, but I wonder if there is hope in our psychedelic therapy.

Very interesting joebono, I can relate very VERY much to some circumstances. For example:



^That is my SAME story haha, except that I wanted to share a mushroom experience with them. They did not accept then.
Now my father is somewhat interested in LSD, and my mother on MDMA and Ayahuasca. The concepts they had about psychedelics is slowly changing since I told them my psychedelic use. They two have had issues, but from my point of view, something like mushrooms or MDMA can help THEM to improve THEIR relationship. On the other hand, I wanted them to try mushrooms with me because I wanted them to share THAT experience with ME.

So, maybe I'm wrong but I would suggest that you suggest MDMA or Mushrooms instead of DMT if your purpose is to improve empathy and "love" in a troubled relationship like the one you described. I don't really know about LSD, since things are (imo) more random and tend to cause a looong bad trip if there is so much BS in one's life.

Well, I really hope the situation gets better and that your parents appreciate the experience.

Thanks for sharing!

That was a pretty massive dose!

Interesting all the same though.

I personally would feel more confident giving someone mushrooms first..becasue they are more consistant a thing to dose I find. With ayahuasca/pharma I dont know how much a specific person needs in comparison to how much i need..will they get too much..or not enough?

With mushrooms you can feed them 2 or 3 grams and thats usually enough to open them up..if not than just feed them another gram..ayahuasca doses seem to varry alot more between individuals probly becasue of varrying MAO profiles..

I also think that people need to want it. MDMA might be good..I have alot of respect for MDMA..but mushrooms really open me up more..but also present more of a challenge..and if people dont really want it..they tend to fight it all the way through and dont let go.

I salute your honesty and fortitude for simply GOING THERE, being there, sitting, guiding, helping, and seeing it through to the end, regardless of outcomes. That is so bold and honest. I wish you the best.

The only advice I can really give is to just listen to your dad, talk with him, feel things out. Be there for him, whether he wants to go again or not. Sometimes powerful experiences take a long time to process. Support him.

The good news is, even when people do fight strong experiences, healing can still take place. I've seen that happen with a friend. All the psychological underpinnings that were adjusted, however, did not reveal themselves until months later, but it was undoubtedly related to the intense journey.

Love and best wishes.

I think your father may have struggled to accept and integrate his experience-the version of 'reality' he was shown was a bit too 'in your face' or 'up close and personal' to be ignored but remained difficult to really give him valuable insights.

If he is physically well eg not hypertensive or on certain medications, I think MDMA would be a better tool for initial steps to self-analysis as its ability to 'persuade' the user to look at themselves is somewhat gentler than that provided by psychedelic tryptamines which are probably more coercive than persuasive in their actions-especially if the partaker has no previous experience of ego-loss.The altered ego provided by MDMA should be ,for the majority of people, 'easier' to work with.

But after an initial foray or 2 with MDMA,I think he may be more receptive to the benefits of the coventional psychedelics.I would suggest psilocybin with perhaps a small dose of a benzodiazepine.

I wonder if his experience provided by your good self has put your dad off venturing in such realms again?Now that would be a pity....

SWIM's 2 cents

"the dose and also substance seems quite a bad choice for a first psychedelic... but I'm sure in retrospect that is crystal clear.

If I did 106mg of DMT my first time EVER I'd probably have a similar experience to be honest. Though currently that would be a relatively pleasant and quite calm experience.

I did 150mg (accidentally, thought it was only 50-60% of that) and if I had a sitter I'd likely have said all those things, wanting it to stop and whatnot. Probably said "NEVER AGAIN" a hundred times during the trip although for sure I am going to, if not that intense definitely close to it.

If it was me having that trip for the FIRST TRIP EVER I'd most likely never take a psychedelic ever again... hope you didn't turn your dad off of these amazing substances with that odd choice of dose and substance."

I thought about whether to give him shrooms or oral DMT. I have had the most progress in self analysis and inward thought processing on oral DMT. My first oral DMT trip was about 100mgs and I felt that was a perfect beginner dose. I decided against the shrooms because the trip is a few hours longer than oral DMT and sometimes a mindfuck develops, whereas DMT gives me consistent clarity. I guess I figured that he would have a similar experience to my trips, but that didn't happen. MDMA seems like a great choice but I have no access to it.

I also have read a lot about ayahuasca healing and while Caapi Copy and freebase DMT is not technically ayahuasca, it is pretty damn close. The aya analogues are powerful medicine and that is why I chose it. Fractal is right, shrooms are probably more consistent in dosage among people and a 2 or 3 gram mushroom trip may have been more appropriate.

See this is the thing with pharma/ayahuasca..106mg would prob blow me away. 4 grams of mimosa, containing say 80mg fullrange with a good dose of caapi and I start forgetting who I am and what it is that I have even done to myself. Individual doses vary so much..also one persons higher dose might be lower for someone else due to the ammount and types of harmalas used..

Ya I agree with the mushrooms suggestion. I saw a thing on nat geo about dose or something and they give terminal medical patients mushroom extracts to help them deal with death. I'm sure it could help someone deal with alot of other things other then death Too.

Maybe cactus??

Or an extract from cactus??

To help him open up.

I would certainly feel bad if someone dosed me like that.
Do you think he will open himself up to another experiment
after having gotten thrown into this experience of impending doom ,unprepared ?

Unlikely... or was this not as traumatizing for him as i think it was ?

I can't imagine tripping with my folks, or even mentioning it as a possibility. But I can't help but wonder what it would be like to step sideways with the humans who created you....

What a great thread! A friend of mine and I are currently debating how/if to share these expereinces with our 50-ish wives (who both know about it and are very curious). We're both really torn about this. Everytime I think about helping her take a step towards p-nauting, I think of another two reasons for NOT doing it. So it hasn't happened, and I don't think it will. Maybe if she's motivated to do a lot of research and shows a tremendous eagerness to do it, I would reconsider.

But I've recently come to the conclusion that either one should come to this decision point in their lives entirely by themselves, or with the help of medical/research professionals. Given where we're all coming from, I have to respect and be grateful for the work the scentific and medical community is currently doing in this field ... this research will attain legitimacy in the upcoming years and lead to important discoveries that actually help people.

That said......if I ever WERE in the position of helping a close family member with their first experience......it would be San Pedro. In this new psychonauting phase of my life (last 8 months, after a gap of almost 40 years) it's been my only method. With it, I'm able to exist in two amazing states at once - the normal world and the underlying space/time expanded world - and the interaction between the two worlds is something I'm able to work with and benefit from in real time. Not to mention what I can take away from the trip afterwards (never been able to do that with shrooms or anything else). So sure, I'd like to share that with people I care about, but it may not be my destiny to do so in this lifetime.

Though I'm not expecting spice to work that way in me at all, I am looking forward to my first attempt at it soon.

I just spoke with my parents and they said that there were some new insights gained and deeper connections made. I don't think my father had a classic "universe exploding in your face, end of the world" experience. He has some issues with power and control and the DMT experience forced him to give up the steering wheel for a while. I don't think he is shut off to a future experience, especially if it can help him locate some of the underlying reasons for his behavior.

I really just want him to reach the trip level where his thoughts become a stream of consciousness and he just talks and talks for hours about his feelings. I have oral DMT trips where I engage in conversation with myself for hours on end and I find it extremely cathartic, similar to twenty years of psychotherapy in three hours. I was hoping that he would have that type of trip. Maybe next time.

I would start with a MUCH smaller dose next time(if he wants to try again)

then work him up to what you gave him from the start. I bet you would see a black/white difference between the 106mg dose at the end.

seems to be the best way to acclimate someone to any psychedelic that's used for therapy. hell, some of the DMT trials I've read about started with low doses that were incremented. that included oral, intravenous and smoked.

My Dad said he is ready to try mushrooms. I figure I will give him 2.5 or 3 grams. He said that he thought the experience was helpful, especially after the peak and the afterglow the next day. My parents were able to delve deeper into the underlying causes of some of his behavior.

2.5g would probably be good if they are cubensis, not if they are strong cyanescens though.

Gave 2g to my non-tripper roomie and he had a nice time.

Prepare him for the comedown though, he sounds like he has a similar mindset to SWIM who freaked the #$%^ out on the comedown of his first trip despite an AMAZING and euphoric peak.

If SWIM was told this before and during his first trip on shrooms he would have had a much better time after the peak:

"even though the visuals and feeling high might have faded, thoughts and ideas will continue to "chatter" in your mind possibly nonsensically, just find something simple to concentrate on like drawing, music or simply sitting in a dim room with eyes closed can help the transition back to sobriety"

Yeah quite! and also, at the original poster: personally I don't think he needs another trip. You know the thing with difficult experiences is they can either cause a major turnaround or you can just flop; you'll just have to trust that this is the beginning of his major turnaround.

how could an experience like this, for somone his age, who has not done this kind of thing very often (i.e its commmpletely new and underhead of and unusual for him) NOT cause a life-changing result?

Just be patient man, wait and watch for the results.

Great!
I think mushrooms might do very good things for him. I would NOT mix them with anything. They have always worked best for me alone and the afterglow is always the best when I do them like that.