Hi,
sorry if I am maybe asking the obvious but I couldn't find clear answers.

Swim smoked a bit of Changa yesterday. About one to two hours later he had 0.6 g of Albino Penis Envy shrooms and when they started acting he was quite suprised as he forgot that there probably still was active maoi from the changa in his system.

He said that the first hour or so the experience reminded him much more of spice than what he knew of mushrooms so far. As the experience was pretty amazing but more a kind of happy accident he got curious and now wants to find out more.

Is there a good guide somewhere? When it comes to Psilohuasca everybody is talking about eating maoi instead of smoking it.

Thee first thing that is unclear is why there are very clear diet instructions for Ayahuhasca but nothing like this mentioned when it comes to Changa. Is a smoked MAOI less long lasting or less intense that there aren't issues regarding accumulation of Tyramin or transmitters in the synaptic gap?

What are the different maoi options? I know there are Syrian Rue, Banisteriopsis caapi, some pharmaceutical products but I am sure there are more or lets say which of those options is recommended and why?

How do the options differ? Form of consumption, duration, dosage etc.

I suppose swim had a really good time because he was careful and took very little but I suppose things could have gone wild if that wouldn't have been the case. Trial and error seems either very dangerous or very time consuming so it would be great if swim could get some more info on that.

Thanks for helping

You can smoke syrian rue on mushrooms and ayahuasca and ramp up the trip considerably.

MAOI diet when it comes to food isn’t really a thing with harmalas. If you have a beer it’ll make you really drowsy but that’s about it. Only gets dangerous with pharmaceuticals like antidepressants or MDMA. The traditional Amazonian diet has nothing to do with MAOI’s, it is an ascetic diet that is used with any and all psychedelics. Mushroom shamans in Mexico follow the same diet.

Pharmaceutical MAOI’s that were used as antidepressants decades in the past were far more powerful than harmalas. If you had a beer on those, it would be your last.

oh that sounds promising. is there any difference between smoking rue or b caapi and how much is a realistic dosage?
I am wondering I didn't see any threads on it.
Also how long do the maoi's last when smoked? Swim was under the impression that the shrooms went back to normal after an hour or so and he smoked the changa 1-2 hours before he took the shrooms.

You can also ingest extracted harmaloids sublingually for psilohuasca. It's very convenient and effective that way. Dose is much lower (30 mg) than when eaten, also it works very quickly, effect could be felt in 10 minutes.

Many times I've inquired about the smoking of harmalas after ingesting mushrooms and, for whatever reason, it appears to not be popular.

After listening to countless hours of Terence McKenna recordings, I came across two recordings back-to-back, one from Terence, one from his brother Dennis, about "vegetable television" where they would smoke B Caapi (which is all about the harmalas/THH) while on mushrooms, and have short bursts of turbocharged trip, like 15-20 minutes. This has piqued my interest, but I still have yet to try it. I don't have B Caapi to work with, but was thinking of making some smoking herbs enhanced with freebase harmine/harmaline/THH specifically to use well underway tripping on the mushrooms.

Please report back any experiences you have with this!

Done it. Load up a bowl of syrian rue and smoke until where you want to be. I’ve gone from a 2 gram trip to what felt like a ten gram trip. And I’ve done ten grams. So I know what I mean when I say that. I smoked a lot of rue to do that. Shit gets more warpy. Lots of sound distortion. It’s not just the potency, the quality changes. And yeah, you can smoke it mid trip and it does that.

It's a well known and common method to smoke DMT before taking mushrooms. Same day, a few hours before, right before... any of it.

It is known that this enhances the mushroom trip and makes it much more DMT like. It's often said that the DMT opens up the mental space and portals of places, and then the mushrooms bring you back into it. Some have even referenced entities, saying that the DMT introduces you to some entities, then the mushroom right after help you get to know them.

The harmalas im sure, too, had their impact on it as well... but there is definitely the effect you described just from using DMT right before mushrooms...

Thanks for your answers.
I suppose it would be most easy to just have some change before then.
I would still be interrested in vaping b caapi or rue but would need dosages to know what I am doing. Not sure about the consumption orally. When doing Ayahuasca I got a pretty upset stomach or is it the Psychotria viridis that is responsible for that? As good as the experience is I felt that feeling a bit sick kept me from diving as deep into it as I could have without feeling that way.
Smoking Changa wasn't an issue at all and the shrooms aorked like explained above - it would be great to be able to repeat that without having to go through too much "experiments".

I like smoalking changa during the comeup on mushrooms. I'll sometimes smoalk moar harmalas with cannabis later in the trip.

For vaping dosage, I'd recommend starting at 30mg amd working your way up to see what works for you.

Orally, harmalas alone won't wreck your stomach too much. You can condition yourself a bit by drinking rue tea. I'd say start with about 3g, roast then until almost all of them pop and then steep in boiling water for bit. Add honey to accommodate the taste. Rue tea alone can be pretty bitter.

One love

Wow I had no idea. I am glad I read this thread. Thanks guys. I really should have smoked harmalas during my Garden Goddess Mushroom trip and for sure will try it with microdosing.

I found this great thread on how to modify an emesh (thanks for that genious idea) https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=99186 which should allow to vape rue or caapi easily.

Thanks for your answers.
Swim now has additionally to shrooms, Changa, Rue Seeds, B. Caapi and Harmala freebase accessible.
He wants to stick to vaporizing the maoi (He read lots of threads and thinks corretly those are RIMA's aren't they and less "serious" than MAOI's?). For this he has a dry herbs atmoizer as well as the modifyed e mesh solution from the thread linked above accessible.
When that happy accident he reported above happened he smoked the Changa roughly 2-3 hours before he had the shrooms. He took 0,7 g Albino Penis Envy.
Now he wants to repeat that but staying on the safe side and starting easy. He doesn't really know how the parameters dosage of RIMA, dosage of shrooms, time in between RIMA and shrooms go with each other and would be super thankful if anyone could point him into the right direction. Obviously consuming the RIMA and the shrooms unlike before will be timed to complement each other well.
With the RIMA, is there a threshold / maximum dosage or how wide is the therapeutic width? What is the smallest amount that can be vaped to be effective, what is the maximum dose? How long do the RIMA's last? Swim read lots of threads and some reported about negative effects when using Rue, so would it be better to use the Caapi instead? Swim had the Rue already but got the Caapi and as he thought that this was the RIMA in the Changa he used when he had his happy accident.
Even having Changa accessible SWIM would like to try just using a RIMA instead of Changa to augment with shrooms as those are always accessible whereas Changa isn't. Swim hopes that the happy accident got its qualities from the RIMA and not the DMT inside the Changa (which after two to three hours probably was broken down already) but doesn't have any experience with this and so is just guessing at the moment.
Being able to take shrooms and relatively precisely dial in another level by adding RIMA's would be really nice (very often swim thinks he should have taken more but was just too careful but taking a second dose usually is more of a guesswork and swim even having quite some experience with shrooms isn't able to tell how much he needs of a second dose to get where he wants).
Swim just had this single augmented experience yet but was under the impression that there maybe was a way to get a DMT-like experience by doing so with the right dosage but he might be wrong with that. If that was the case however it would be great as sourcing mushrooms is no issue compared to dmt containing plants which then also have to be processed.
So if this way would allow to travel to similar destinations SWIM would be very pleased but is a bit wondering why this isn't a topic discussed more widely.
Swim would be very grateful for answers pointing in the right direction. Otherwise he probably is going to start testing with very small amounts, documenting and hopefully finding a good solution at one point.
Thanks for helping and have a nice weekend everyone