Yes, although i said that i believe that the experience is an internal monologue , i would say that at the height of certain experiences, i have believed that there was some kind of external alien contact going on and i don't discount that i will temporarily believe this for future voyages.

In relation to the alien/entity/demon wanting to eat me, while i was in a state of being hyper open to suggestiveness, and therefore believing that this being was some kind of external manifestation, i would like to think that i would just let them get on with it and chow down. Get it over and done with and then they can move on to someone else. I would also like to think that once the harrowing repast of my psyche had finished and i had come down to base level that i would be grateful to be back in meatspace and appreciate my mundane and unremarkable existence for the miracle that it is.

Ponder this-
We are learning and healing in these DMT spaces. Maybe being eaten is saying goodbye to all or parts of you in a spiritual metaphysical sense. maybe being eaten facilitates re-generation or rebirth. Possibly, its represents an out with the old and in with the new situation. I am one who just lets the scenario play out, total and complete surrender to the learning healing process.

I once had an experience on Huachuma where I was out of body and floating above myself. I watched myself die and I watched, peacefully, as I was eaten by wolves and all of my pieces were taken away to the far corners of the universe, deep healing. I understand this was very different situation. I am in these spaces to learn and not necessarily impose my will on the entities. If they want to eat me? I'd probably let them. I'd want to see what the beautiful results of that are.
Be fearless, Surrender, and Learn

Cheers
IH

My opinion, take it or leave it:

First of all, as a disclaimer, it's not supposed that people are making contact with alien entities or another world/dimension/reality every time they use DMT. Some people find this a good enough reason to disregard the reality of all DMT experiences. James Kent, for example, suggested that because a friend of his only ever saw visions of distorted corpse-like faces on DMT, that it's just an unpredictable hallucinogen and shouldn't be taken too seriously. I think this is a mistake.

To use a really flawed and tired analogy, you can cause all sorts of meaningless distortion by interfering with the tuning of a radio receiver. It's variable and unpredictable, and often there's nothing to make of the result, but that doesn't mean it isn't capable of being retuned to something real. The waters are also muddied by the large number of maladjusted or "ideologically keen" people having anomalous experiences.

There are reasonable expectations for what "mind arbitrarily running wild under the influence of a destabilising psychoactive drug" would be like. What is experienced when you seem to make contact with these entities/worlds/dimensions/realities can be so well defined in its alien character, and so purposeful in its content, that reducing it to the effects of a drug feels like an irrational stretch that makes light of the obvious.

In the moment, there are many indescribable impressions that tip you off to the reality of the encounter and the nature of what you're dealing with, but unfortunately they don't carry much weight once you're back here.

Nobody really has any idea what weird mechanics might be underpinning the DMT experience, or how this world/dimension/reality we're in now might structurally relate to something else. I think it is foolish to assume that these experiences are never real, or that you cannot be harmed in some way by interfacing with some of these beings. I am not claiming that I know any of this for certain, but overwhelmingly this is what my instincts tell me.

There are many, many reports of extremely frightening encounters with some of these beings, with a recurring set of themes: they have an agenda, they want to consume the user, operate on them, imprison them, perform a sexual act on them, or harvest something from them. It's common for beings to make offers [sometimes proposed "trades"] that the user doesn't understand, and then become very annoyed if the user doesn't accept or cooperate. There are often elements of torture, perversion, disgust and belittlement. It can be seriously traumatising.

Furthermore, the positive experiences are often not entirely positive. There can be an awful, sinister undertone to everything that is going on. I get the impression that most people experience this and know what I'm talking about here, but when they come back they tend to forget or marginalise this aspect because it's difficult to reconcile, complicates a good story, and they don't want to discourage others from trying it.

It's like you're given your time on the bouncy castle, and it's so grand that you try not to look the gift horse in the mouth. You want to have it, but barely out of sight the other kids are rummaging through your backpack. It can be a very conflicted experience.

Sometimes this is just a playful sort of jest or mockery, maybe, but many people (either immediately or after several trips) get wise to something happening in the background. There's often this sense of illusion and distraction, and people may realise that they're being given a mesmerising display, or being artificially filled with a sensation of bliss and joy, to keep them busy while some strange procedure is performed on them.

This doesn't necessarily mean these beings are up to no good. I mean, if we encounter an injured animal, we might want to help, but we cannot effectively communicate with them. So we take charge in their best interests and restrain or anaesthetise them while we fix the problem.

Sometimes there appears to be good intent behind these procedures, but other times something clearly malevolent or offensively weird is going on. People who've had these experiences know that these "lawyers' explanations", like the mind amplifying and distorting memories or fears of being in the dentist chair, or something, are painfully naive.

These hostile or tricksy encounters are a lot more common than people seem to think, and the same (in my view, irresponsible) advice is given every time somebody reports them:


...or some variation thereof.

On a crap platform like Reddit it'll simply be downvoted to oblivion, but historically on the Nexus, advice of caution regarding the possible reality and consequences of these encounters has often been met with hostility, including by those who themselves believe in the reality of the experience (I'm not talking about the NGC-thing, which clearly reads like a bad fanfic).

The waters are again muddied, because maybe some of these experiences aren't real, and maybe some of them are just valid therapeutic experiences where the user is pushed to confront something unpleasant for their psychological growth, or whatever.

People can believe whatever they want about the DMT experience. Again, I'm not claiming to know for certain that it can be real, or what you should do if confronted by seemingly hostile entities with questionable proposals, but I think we're all gambling with this stuff.

In this world, if a shady character approached and tried to take a bite out of you, tried to rape you, tried to distract you while their accomplice picked your pocket, or tried to swap a penny for your liver, you wouldn't second guess yourself. And that's to say nothing of elaborate scams and hoaxes where the reality isn't immediately obvious.

I'm reminded of this quote:


Does the DMT experience involve some immaterial part of us visiting another place? Does it allow beings from outside this world to interface with our minds? I don't know. At least in this world, the consequences of hostile encounters are fairly predictable. Would you really bet that you're risking nothing in these bizarre realms? Are you really going to trust the opinion of anybody who tells you that it's harmless, and that you should let these beings do whatever they want?

The safest assumption is that this is an unpredictable ticket to a multitude of possibly real places and experiences - at least as multiplistic as the one we're in now - some possibly beneficial or harmless, some possibly harmful, some not involving entities either way.

Assuming you have the choice or ability to deny or resist some of the apparently hostile interactions, I think you should deny or resist with as much force of will as you can muster.

Damn, well said. And I am in general agreement.

As I say and will continue to say; no one knows what's going on in hyperspace. The molecule is physically safe, but is the experience always psychologically safe? As Syragote mentioned, there are plenty of reports of people being traumatized by a DMT experience.

I find myself wondering very often how much of a safety blanket the idea "it's all in your head is," considering we don't know. I've had plenty of experiences, with and without entities, where I struggle to find what "part" of me may be being interacted with. Some of the experiences surely don't seem or feel that way, especially some of the more alien ones. Some may say "those are just parts of yourself that you are unaware of." Perhaps, but to me that kind of response is synonymous to those who will speak about how God operates until reaching a point where they cannot address a specific instance, and default to "God works in mysterious ways." It doesn't carry much weight for me, and neglects to address the potential and possibility of "the other side," in this case, the other side being that it's not "all in one's head."



A bit of a paradox we find ourselves in with this, because it can also be argued under certain scopes as irrational to attempt to explain it as mechanisms other than the mind.

To restate, it's implications like the ones shared that cause me to suspend judgment and entertain all possibilities regarding the ontological nature of hyperspace and its inhabitants. And though I don't know anything one way or another, I still stand by suspending judgment on entities while also standing firm to the ones that are more alarming. I suppose my not judging them is my way of tricking them into treating me better than they may have initially intended, just as they may be simultaneously tricking me.

Stay aware, take things with a grain of salt.

One love

I agree wholeheartedly with everything you say, Syragote, and I find your message very very important.

It's been two and half years of pretty active (predominantly oral) DMT use and I still don't know what to make of it. I most certainly have benefited a lot from it and it has brought me unquestionably beneficial real life changes, but I've also been put many times into tough situations where my integrity has been challenged. When I started, I was in a situation where I had exhausted my ordinary problem-solving skills and it felt like I need to take the risk and explore the hyperspace if I hope to move forward. Not so much anymore. I try my best to weigh whether the risk is worth the gain as I'm unsure what the gain currently is.

While there is generally nothing wrong in doing things just for fun, DMT might be an exception. For me it has brought into mind a lot of what is said about magic in stories and fairytales. You open yourself up to powers that aren't entirely under your control and if you do it just for amusement, you are putting yourself into a risk. If it is a small risk or a huge risk is probably up to the circumstances and your personal situation, but the more you have impulsive craving to experience the fascination, the less discernment you are likely to have and the more influence the alien elements of hyperspace have on you.

Previously I had an intense desire for healing, and I did get that, although it came through trials. Last few times I've been visiting the hyperspace just to pay a visit and see how things are there. In one of these experiences I had a vision of some servant like entities. They interrupted their work to answer my call. I felt ashamed for having disturbed them for no reason other than just playing around. Something a drunken master might do, and that's not what I want to be.

The more respect I have put into these experiences the more respect I have got in return. For me being respectful means having an intention and a reason for establishing the connection. The more habitual the use, the less clear the intention. But I recognize that even when I don't have much of an intention there is the fascination to experience more and more. That fascination can attract entities and energies who give you just what you ask for: experiences and fascination. And if you lack the respect you are likely to attract entities that don't care about your respect, because they give none in return. Or more properly put, the entities that care about reciprocal respect are unlikely to respond.

These thoughts are still preliminary in many ways, but I believe DMT is a very powerful tool for invoking energies that are alien to our everyday knowledge and this fact should be taken with serious respect and caution. Not everybody gets to experience the more powerful side of it everytime, but you shouldn't put your guard down just because of that.

With regards to surrendering, if you have built a level of confidence and trust, like in a romantic relationship, surrendering can be a wonderful thing, but you most certainly shouldn't surrender to every stranger you meet on the street. When talking about surrendering to the experience in a general sense, yes, after you have decided to take the trip, you must accept to experience what it brings about, you can't just decide to stop and quit the experience. But accepting to go through the experience is a different thing than surrendering to every illusion you experience. You can and should learn to say no thanks to things you are uncomfortable with. The good guys will respect you taking your time. New opportunities will arise. Learning to let go of unhelpful thoughts and images is very important skill in your everyday life too.

All this comes from the perspective of how I have experienced the hyperspace and it's dark aspects. I understand that for some people the dark side may not appear that stark and it's therefore more natural to stress the positive in order to strengthen the positive suggestions that in turn attract positive energies. However, I find being critical of what you encounter to be a very very important skill in navigating these spaces, and even then we all have blind spots even when we think we are critical.

This is not to say the points about surrendering to this particular experience cannot be valid. This is just something to take into account if you're feeling uncomfortable, especially if you get a sinister tone in what you encounter.

I love this ^^



I find this important. Very much so. I've always thought of surrendering as a giving myself over to the experience, but never in a sense where I've decided not to exercise my own agency. My agency and self-control are pivotally important to my behaviors on the whole, even in hyperspace, and help direct the trajectory of my experience in any aspect of life, including in hyperspace, which help delimit how many unfortunate events can be experienced as well as how I navigate through the world. Critical thought is part of the parcel of this in my mind.

We have little control in the grand scheme of what happens to us, but have a great deal of control over how we respond to it. Once we've left the dock, we must accept and surrender to the fact we are "somewhere else." This doesn't mean that we let whatever happen to us without trying to navigate the instances in which things can happen.

As Terence McKenna was told in a DMT trip, "don't give in to amazement."

Stay aware, think critically

One love

Hi hug454,

ever considered asking same question about (sober) night dreams? Different but potential relevance of the question towards risk/consequences of the "exposure" stays valid.
Dear g*d what have I dreamed stuff in my life

Hi Jees, yes indeed i feel the same way about dreams. I am in the moment and fully immersed and wake up and sometimes think.. "thank christ for that, it was just a dream" and then i cogitate on the relevance the dream has to what is/has been going on in my mind. Some dreams are easy to fathom and translate, some are pretty oblique and some disappear from my mind too quickly for me to give any kind of analysis.
Once, quite some time ago, i was induced into a coma after having a bike smash. And during the initial weeks i was completely unconscious and in order to be woken safely (my blood pressure had to be kept low in order for a repair on my aorta to heal) the nurses and docs brought me out of deep sleep over a period of about a week and there was some fairly disturbing stuff going on in my head and how i was relating to my environment at the time, for what seemed like the whole week. Non stop . A lot of those dreams i remember to this day. Ive never been so pleased to wake up properly and realise that none of it was real. But i was able to translate the less weird stuff and relate it to my life. I was high as a kite after waking up and that feeling still carrys water for me almost 20 years later.



For me that is a very positive and beautiful way to deal with a possibly very traumatic experience.


Just to add that, i am not the kind of person that thinks "oh it's all in your head so it doesn't matter." I think that it makes it more important to deal with because it is an inner demon and i do not believe that fighting one's inner demons in these kinds of worlds leads to any kind of outcome in the outside world. Believing that these entities are some kind of inter dimensional beings attacking us when we are under the influence could lead to carrying this trauma into the meatspace world and maybe psychosis.
But that's just me and what i have come to be believe from the experiences of life that i have had over the years. My experiences in life have also taught me that i could very well be wrong in some cases...

I find no fixed stance on the matter.

Wether in trip, night dream or just wakey alive, in all these "realms" we might get confronted with traumatic experiences. Sometimes I find myself quite able to cope and another time/day something feels broken forever.

The nature of the confrontation plays a role but even more so my own capacity to deal with it, and that capacity might vary from day to day. This prevents me from taking on a fixed strategy. When I feel on top, let it come. When I find myself vulnerable, please no hard confrontation to swallow, in none of the mentioned realms.

It's not always 100% clear to know in advance how much of anticipation level I have until the issue presents itself, but 'general energy level' (by lack of better wording) is an indicator a bit trustworthy. When tired or too much pot-days then I loose my feeling of being rooted hence lesser capacity to handle a whack on my track.