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got the green light for tryptophan decarboxylation analysis Options
 
benzyme
#1 Posted : 2/17/2010 6:54:22 PM

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my prof gave me permission to analyze the componenents of a tryptophan decarboxylation experiment (refluxed in heavy mineral oil), via CE-MS/MS using 5µm i.d. capillaries; it may be mentioned in a future publication (journal of analytical chem)

Cool

*stoked*
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
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STS is a community for people interested in growing, preserving and researching botanical species, particularly those with remarkable therapeutic and/or psychoactive properties.
 
benzyme
#2 Posted : 2/17/2010 7:13:15 PM

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here's a paper pertaining to past experiments

Fingerprint analysis of thermolytic decarboxylation of tryptophan to tryptamine catalyzed by natural oils
http://www.sciencedirect...4dcc52596a164ea1ea9e00ed
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
 
Xt
#3 Posted : 2/17/2010 7:27:15 PM

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For a budding future chemist, about to start my degree this year...
And in the most humble sense, what does this mean?

Im curious but clueless.

“Right here and now, one quanta away, there is raging a universe of active intelligence that is transhuman, hyperdimensional, and extremely alien... What is driving religious feeling today is a wish for contact with this other universe.”
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benzyme
#4 Posted : 2/17/2010 7:49:31 PM

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removal of the carboxylic group from tryptophan... carbon dioxide evolution due to applied heat.

it should be done in an inert atmosphere to prevent autooxidation from air (otherwise a normally clear product turns dark).
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
 
Infundibulum
#5 Posted : 2/17/2010 10:08:52 PM

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Good job benz, congratulations!

xtechre wrote:
For a budding future chemist, about to start my degree this year...
And in the most humble sense, what does this mean?

Im curious but clueless.

Tryptophan decarboxylation makes tryptamine. Tryptamine may be dimethylated.

Need to calculate between salts and freebases? Click here!
Need to calculate freebase or salt percentage at a given pH? Click here!

 
benzyme
#6 Posted : 2/18/2010 12:33:59 AM

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thanks


in theory, tryptamine may also be supplemented to the substrate or casing of psilocin-producing fungi (the job for an mg scale and a micropipette) Wink
the trick is getting the solutions right, and running a control group
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
 
ms_manic_minxx
#7 Posted : 2/18/2010 4:47:53 AM

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How exciting!! Cool

Write a science paper for the Nexus!!
Some things will come easy, some will be a test
 
Aegle
#8 Posted : 2/18/2010 5:34:16 AM

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Benzyme

Wow this is so awesome! You should feel super proud...


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Virola78
#9 Posted : 2/22/2010 11:38:20 PM

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Sounds like something you really want to do Smile
So you are going to analyze the different reaction products? The THBC by products as mentioned in the abstract?
The goal is to learn more about the diferent catalysts in the essential oils and the mechanisms involved?

benzyme wrote:
thanks
in theory, tryptamine may also be supplemented to the substrate or casing of psilocin-producing fungi (the job for an mg scale and a micropipette) Wink
the trick is getting the solutions right, and running a control group


That sounds really interesting too..
If only our atmosphere was inert... sigh.. Pleased

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I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
 
benzyme
#10 Posted : 2/23/2010 12:03:57 AM

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as long as the fungal cells are not ruptured, it wouldn't matter.

the inert atmosphere would be applied when drying (in a desiccator) Wink

and no...the alternative experiment (outside the lab) would involve refluxing the tryptophan in a high-boiling mineral oil under nitrogen (no catalyst), and allowing the product to collect on a friedrich condenser.
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
 
Virola78
#11 Posted : 2/23/2010 1:28:29 PM

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I thought you meant the decaboxylation (tryptophan->tryptamine) would have to take place in an inert atmosphere?
Then the tryptamine (and perhaps by-products) could be supplemented (not by injection!) to the mushrooms?
If so, then the tryptamine would oxidize in the substrate no?

Sorry if this sounds silly Embarrased .. just trying with my limited knowledge about organic chemistry to picture what you are suggesting.

IF the experiment was worked out (written down and suficiently validated (with help of others here at the nexus)) then i am sure there are peeps here that would love to try this scientific experiment.

Is tryptphane (or tryptamine Smile readily and easily avaible?



Why do i ask these questions?
Because i have the strong feeling all the knowledge, experience, materials and equipment are avaible to do some serious scientific researching the subject of psychedelics. Perhaps the university is not interest in such experiments.. but still there is allot that can be done, for us, for this community. Comparing mescaline teks per example (yield, quality). Or seriously (scientific way) tackle the problems of dmt extraction from grasses.

We as a collective can design, set-up AND fund simple experiments.
This can be arranged fairly easy. I have no doubt about it.

“The most important thing in illness is never to lose heart.” -Nikolai Lenin

I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant.
 
benzyme
#12 Posted : 2/23/2010 2:08:26 PM

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tryptophan is readily available, and you thought correctly..free-form tryptophan should be refluxed in an inert atmosphere. otherwise, recrystallization of the dark product will give some tryptamine, but yield will be low. and the free-form tryptamine should be converted to hcl salt to make it more water soluble.
tryptamine in hcl salt form will not oxidize as easily as tryptamine, though it does.

however, there have been(a few) reports of successful experiments
it's a matter of getting the right concentrations


"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
 
 
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