Hi all - I recently tried DMT for the first time and had a difficult experience. Since I was using a vape pen I’m not sure what the dose was, but I took two medium hits, which promptly launched me from my bedroom to some other place. When I came to in this other realm, I felt an “evil presence” and had an awful feeling as if my brain was being starved of oxygen (which surely was not the case) and had a bit of a panic. I hung on for dear life until landing safely back in bed a few minutes later.

I’ve since decided to experiment with low doses hoping to get a comfort level with the molecule so I can progress to an eventual full dose. What I’ve found is that I’m getting more comfortable with how my head feels, but I can’t get past this feeling that I am being taken in by some ominous force. The feeling is accompanied by warm vibrations traveling through my body, which I can’t help but perceive as this evil force taking hold of me, which I find terrifying. I at first attributed this to nerves, but this experience persists despite believing that my nerves are now in check.

I am hoping to get some insight into these experiences as well as some guidance about how to proceed. Some have suggested that I should go straight to a higher dose to “blow past” this part of the trip, but others have cautioned that doing so could lead to a traumatic experience.

I’d be grateful to hear your input.

Thanks!

Hi ReadySteadyGo,

I recommend buying some peganum harmala and make and consume a brew before taking the DMT hit. It slows down things a lot and gives warmth to the experience.

If it still feels bad, you can go the pharmahuasca route and instead of vaping, consume the harmala containing plant and DMT orally.

I agree. Moderately dosed harmala's make the whole experience a lot easier to handle.

Thanks very much. I will look into peganum harmala.

Quick followup. If I continue to experience this ominous presence even if in a very relaxed state, do you suppose that would be more indicative of my psychological state or of my physiological constitution? I know this may be impossible to answer, but I would love to hear any thoughts.

Hello friend. How many times have you smoke DMT in total up until now?

Try to be careful about the conclusions you draw about the space. It's an enigma, and what you identify as evil may really not be; it could just be that otherworldly. Try to suspend judgements and rephrase statements so they say something about you and not the space.

One love

Hello friend - Thanks for your interest! I did that first “medium dose” last week, and since then I have taken a “light dose” (ie one medium hit) around a half dozen times. (IOW, I’ve been doing the light doses daily for around a week. I hope I’m not asking for trouble with that frequency of light dosing?)

That advice sounds very on point, wise and doable. Thank you!

You got it no trouble at all. As a personal example one of the last times that I had a breakthrough I accidentally judged some entities who ended up giving me gifts. Things aren't what they seem and a lot of our binary judgments are transcended in the space.

As for your frequency you should be fine with light doses however until you get to know the spice doing higher doses can lead to a hyper slap if one is not careful.

One love

There could be a physical component to it as well. Have you ever done any other psychedelic substance than DMT?

Substances like DMT are potent vasoconstrictors and often cause slight constriction in other organs and tissues as well, like the bronchi.

I think that the rapid onset of such effects can have a bit of an ominous vibe to it indeed, because it is exactly what you would experience after having taken a powerfull toxin, right when it starts kicking in. A quick build-up of physical effects that would be deadly if they would just continue to grow in intensity like that for hours.

This is one of the reasons why harmala's could help. They are vaso and broncholidators. They don't just slow down the experience a bit, but they also counter the constriction of tissues in your body.

I personally believe that constriction of bloodflow and breathing, automatically creates a little tension psychologically, on a subcounscious level. The feeling that somehow, something aint right.

We often fear what we don't understand or can't quite grasp all the way. DMT is great for producing states and feelings that fit that category, a wide spectrum of them actually.

I more often like to add DMT into the mix when I'm already above baseline with something else these days because it feels less abrupt and abrasive going in.

I'm curious...What's the setting like when you are doing this in your room? Are you listening to music? Are you setting any type of intentions or creating space beforehand in some way?

Would you consider edibles a suitable substance for this? Last night after taking some edibles I felt like I was in a very good headspace and thought that might lead to a good DMT experience, but wasn't sure if that was a recommended practice.



I've tried it with and without music. I think the music helps. (The music I go for is typically very mellow and melodic. Most of the music I see others listening too when doing DMT is more visceral and tribal, so not sure if I'm creating the wrong energy.)

I start the session by lying in bed, taking two deep breaths, and focusing on my intention, which by default is "let go and learn." In life, I'm always an eager student, but not quite so eager to let go :-)

These are some great thoughts. I think having a better understanding here will help me to temper my reaction. Many thanks.

Just today I experienced something that I would call falling off the wave, the void.

It can be seen as your tutor. The virtue that you can build is bravery.

If you can tolerate the void without getting lost into it, it can be wielded as a power.

Well, first off I'm not that experienced having only been interested in DMT for a couple of years so far. But certainly in my world I've been through periods of less pleasant experiences. After a reasonable break due to a very strong and confusing trip I came back and was relieved to be welcomed and given love. I learned that it's impossible to judge the molecule from a handful of encounters. As Void often says, it's always got something new to show you and you never know what you're going to get.

As to use frequency it seems personal. Some can go every day, others like to moderate. You'll have to work out your own schedule over time.hope to hear some progress in the future from your travels.

this sounds to me like a classic case of evil misidentification. when people experience certain things they associate with evil they assume the entity to be an evil one, when it very rarely actually is.
for example when people see big, sharp teeth they assume the entity is evil in some way, but actually they just have big, sharp teeth. the serpent is a very good example, that many people assume should be evil in some way due to it being snake-like, but most people from what i have seen feel a loving embrace from the serpent.
a real life example i love is dogs. dogs have sharp teeth, they snarl, they are hunting and killing machines and if you watch them in nature they might be considered an evil force, but in reality (at least from a human perspective) they are one of the most loving animals in the world. some people still fear them though and it makes sense why.

maybe you would benefit from a recalibration of what it means to be evil. what does a person/entity/object/etc have to do or be to be truly classed as evil in your eyes? and does that really make them evil? once you figure that out you may find that you were simply acting on instinct and being overly worried about the intentions of other entities.

how would you like it if they started accusing you of being evil just because of your greasy, smooth skin and hairy patches on your body?

i think the most important take home info is that these entities cannot hurt you. they are in a different place with no access to your physical form. so even if you do come across an evil one it can only taunt you, which is only as powerful as you allow it to be.

i hope that gives you some food for thought and can help you see the love that these entities have to offer. even when they are a jerk, they are our jerk
good luck <3

This is a great question. When I was maybe 10 or 11 I must have had some trauma because I had a nightmare that still terrifies me 40 years later. The notion of evil I am working with now was forged in that nightmare. According to this notion, a presence or entity is “evil” if it has the power to make me suffer and will use that power mercilessly. I need to explore this further. I hope I can figure out how to effectively use DMT in this exploration! (Maybe I already am?)

The power these entities have is through fear. Usually it's the fear that they are made of and fear that provides them. In dreams you usually don't have much control over the fearsome presence, but that is different with psychedelics. If you are able to stop and consider whether there is anything substantial to the fear and calmly just (sometimes quite literally) stare your demons, it's likely that they'll start to lose their grip.

Usually this requires that you are in a safe situation in your life and the fear is mostly just residue that you can now let go off.

I believe losing control is one common factor in these fears and often these fears start to build up already in the childhood, but as we grown up, we have the possibility of taking more adult stance at them. It takes courage, but can help a lot in building equanimity.

Of course you shouldn't stretch your psyche too much. If those worlds seem like too much to handle, it's best to take break and maybe return later, change approach, setting, the method / substance / dose or just take it very slow.

Also, repulsion is something that should not be conflated with fear. If you experience something that seems malevolent or doesn't align with your values, it's an act of courage to just say no thanks and not get stuck with it.

Apologies for the slight derailment, but I feel addressing this may make things a little easier for the OP.



Try not to get too caught up with how other people approach these experiences and allow yourself the freedom to forge your own path. No one has a monopoly or final say in how these substances are used and there is certain more than one "right" way, dictated by each individual. I tend to listen to more ambient/melodic/ethereal/weird music as well as tribal. Depends on my goal, intent, and overall context for that particular journey.

One love

you should know that these entities do not have the power to make you suffer. they can taunt you at worst but the only power they have is to convince you that they have more power than they do. i know it is much easier said than done, but try to remember this when you visit them.
in my experience most entities are not interested in harming anybody anyway, they are mostly curious, like we might have been when we were kids and we found an interesting looking bug, but without the ability to actually touch that bug.
and remember, you look just as weird to this entity as the entity does to you, so don't be judgemental