I'm aware of that, but what I refer to is a potential next evolution of that act following this fiasco.

So you are thinking they could transform the act so it outlaws anything containing drugs being sold for human consumption?

Not anything specific at all, but regardless of that act in particular, the general worry regarding this incident is that what you stated could potentially happen. Plenty of plants are already illegal, and plenty more are quickly on their way. I'm just saying to prepare for the worst, wishful thinking will get us nowhere.

Should MHRB be outlawed, we will just have to experiment with other plants.

What do you think the best method of going about a potential outlaw of MHRB would be? Of course we would search for alternatives, but that is not effective in the long run. Each plant will be banned until we run out of plants. The only other option, which I believe should be used alongside circumventing the laws, would be to prove that the War on Drugs has been a failure and is a waste of tax-payer money. Maybe we could get word out about just how much less taxes people would have to pay should drugs be legalized. That's my opinion. What's yours?

I think you'll find this to be the general consensus, here, along with countless other points countering prohibition.


Personally, I don't think anyone here should just sit back watch MHRB become illegal, a stand must be made somewhere. For SWIM in particular, MHRB isn't even simply a source of DMT. Jurema has it's own character and significance and must openly cultivated, studied and utilized in regards to this.

I think MHRB will be banned regardless of what we do. The government simply will not change it's mindset over night. It will be a long drug out process. Using other plants is only a temporary solution until prohibition has been put out.

I guess we could all throw some money into a pot and challenge the constitutionality of prohibition through the court system. We could fight them on their own turf. The problem with that is how it would be organized. It's a big feat that would require lots of money for the best of lawyers. This probably would not work as of now because 5 of the 9 SCOTUS judges are conservative.

We could always start a church. That seems like a successful way to circumvent the law. From what I see, everyone on here has similar if not the same beliefs. You could call it a religion. Santo-Daime 2.0.

I love the spirit of Mimosa.

I love the spirit of Caapi, and could never substitute Caapi with Rue.

I don't want to be FORCED by "law" to give up my practice with something I love.

Yes, grasses should be explored, regardless--but I want to explore grasses for the sake of exploring grasses, for the sake of learning from them and building a relationship with their unique personality, not because Mimosa got "crossed off the list" and I had to "move on" to "something else." That's like saying, well, my husband was just intentionally murdered in cold blood, but there are other guys out there, so I'll just move on to someone else? YES, there are plenty of wonderful, sentient, loving plants to work with, but the idea of "dropping something" and "moving on" to *consume* another just misses the point and the beauty completely of having a spiritual, co-creative relationship with conscious plants. And what about the horror in which this is happening? It's not okay! THIS IS *NOT* OKAY!!!

What happens when "something else" gets crossed off the list? Or whatever?

Oh, shit. This seriously makes me want to cry. I am so upset.

Ayahuasca is the best thing ever. DMT is the most beautiful, sublime, wonderful, healing, humbling, expanding, loving, inspiring medicine ever.

Oh...

I seriously can't even read other threads here about journey reports. I am so sad.

I have no money and I don't live in America (but I am... eek... American!). What can I do?

This is seriously eating my soul. If being alive is illegal... what is our best course of action?

I did not mean to come off as saying the plant will never be legalized. I meant to say that the plant will be crossed off the list for now until we get the ball rolling in the other direction to reverse the possibly upcoming ban. The government has inertia that is not able to be instantly reversed (If that makes sense ). It will take time.

P.S.: Your analogy regarding a husband being murdered in cold blood is perfect!

Yes, I do understand about working with other plants in the time being... just while hubby's knife wounds are healing. And maybe we will all learn some new scientific things [always good], and make new plant friends [always good].

Sometimes a healing crisis can be scary...

I just don't want anyone to "settle" for any intrusion on our birth rights, or "give up" amazing spiritual allies.

I saw this intense poster at the local rock shop the other day (bought some Selenite wands, I am going to spend the next few days in serious ceremonial prayer...). It had a woman standing alone on a rock, saying something to the effect of, "Only after the last tree has been cut down, only after the last animal has been killed, will you realize that money cannot be eaten."

We started one! Here it is, currently called The Jurema Way http://www.dmt-nexus.me/...g=posts&m=25167&

BBB should contact Amnesty International, Survival International, Davi Kopenawa Yanomami, Law Enforcement Against Prohibition, Maps, Sting, and whatever other NGOs and personalities may help, and ask them all to speak out against this government action that could cut off thousands upon thousands of entheogen devotees from being able to practice their religion. I was going to do this myself when I woke up, but surely it's better if someone on his team co-ordinates this stuff- they already have their donation fund rolling to campaign for his freedom. He should encourage people to turn up to protest peacefully and respectably at designated times and places, using the religious freedom argument for why his business is essential to the community.

Many of us are not Christians, but if the retailers disappear then we will be faced with a choice: join a Christian group such as the UDV or Daime, or be cut off from our sacraments. That is religious persecution!

The problem with starting a religion to connect people with the sacraments if the botanical sellers stop selling is that some of you in America would need to devote their lives to it for it to work. You would need contacts such as the botanical sellers have to be able to source the entheogens, you would need funds to fight the government when they seize your sacrament and imprison your leaders, and you would need a network such as the Nexus to keep the faith connected. Such a strategy would be an enormous struggle, and who here is honestly prepared to give up their career and risk their savings to take on that challenge?

I don't want to be a pessimist, but after careful reading of the fedral drug statute (see the ayahuasca forum thread referenced above for the statute # and exact wording) it looks like MHRB and all other DMT containing plants are already illegal to distribute. They are not illegal to possess as long as there is no intent to use them in an illegal manner or distribute them. Clearly BBB was distributing them. No idea how it will all shake out in court, but the wording of the law is very clear. It says any material containing any quantity of DMT is illegal to distribute.
Damn....


Pokey

Here's that link. Page 2 or 3 has the relevant info.

Pokey

Check out the aya forums thread and you'll find lawyers themselves arguing about what the law actually is, and I think the interpretation is still up for grabs, and that is what this case is meant to decide.

Are you going to give up, or are you going to fight for your rights? For god's sake people, mobilise, this is our lives we are talking about, we need Americans protesting and alerting the relevent NGOs and sympathetic celebrities! Or be lazy, and lose access to the entheogens for good.

I will not give up. I am not, however, in a position to be able to do ANYTHING that will expose the fact that I do anything illegal. This is not a selfish position as it may seem at first. I am willing to sacrifice for the greater good of our community, but I will not sacrifice others (ie: my wife and children) for anything.

I was simply pointing out that the wording of the law is quite clear. Read it and tell me how it can be interpreted any other way.


Pokey the Clandestine Revolutionary

Someone got Woody Harrelson's number?

If you become active, you're going to have to make sacrifices--not of your family but of your activities. This goes for everyone: By all means stay underground if you're going to continue clandestine activities, but we need a more active public side without that kink in their armor.

The progress that's been made by the community over the last few years is incredible, so perhaps it's time to take a break for some members and activate to fight prohibition.



Absolutely. But I'd like to add that if the community continues to simply indulge while these things are still legal, the whole culture will be squandered. By all means, stock up if intend to preserve these plants for a greater purpose than personal use, but that's not going to last forever. The community will die if its policy is simply to horde and continue with business as usual.

I couldn't have said it better, amor_fati.

I'll add that I don't think anything will happen until people physically relocate to live near each other. That's how it was done with every other persecuted group. "Strength in numbers" doesn't apply in online forums. It only applies when those people can see and hear each other.

Were people to live near each other, they would not need to post their SWIM's illegal ventures online for every government watch program to monitor to their will. They could have a real and tangible social support system of close friends. Antrocles can vouch for the power of face-to-face support:


I hope you do make it happen, antrocles. If no one does, then I'm not sure how far the knowledge of entheogens can spread. We'll always be able to keep up small, disorganized and dispersed communities like the Nexus, but is that what we want as our endgame? The knowledge within DMT deserves more than just an online forum. It deserves to be free of persecution. It deserves to be shared.

Well too many things contain "any quantity of DMT". Even things at the grocery store like the cashiers and managers themselves, the meat being sold, and some edible mushrooms contain small amounts of DMT. So that law is too vague and would outlaw too many common items to have any meaning, and my interpretation is that it is meant solely to mean the chemical as an isolated compound being added to something, not as something that natural occurs in meat and mushrooms sold at the grocery store, or anything else like that.

Someone, for the love of god, write up a meat tek.

Does anyone know how much DMT there is in the human body as a percentage? I am about 90kgs, there must be loads of spice in me. When I pop my clogs I will donate myself to the nexus for the first human extraction.