Aloha peeps! It has been almost a year since I last posted here, so this is exciting! I always love to discuss ideas with this community due to the never-ending richness of articulate thoughts and experiences present herein. I have been musing over the subject of nudity lately and intend to give a speech on the subject of Naturism for one of my courses, entitled Gender and Communication in Media, which seeks to examine and deconstruct pop-culture messages.

It is my present opinion that prohibition of nudity in public is eventually corrosive to a healthy neurological development. Such prohibitions lead to taboos and consolidation of insidious cultural norms which promote clothed flesh. Moreover, such norms not only undermine the importance of practicing social nudity, but also invoke repulsion towards public nudity in the clothed audience. Beaches and other places where naturism is accepted or encouraged can certainly be considered an exception; however, such places are confined to certain boundaries, and therefore maintain minimal influence on the established norm of clothing.

Now, certainly we wear clothing for a wide number of legitimate reasons, i.e. for fashion, expression of identities, protection of fragile organs, adaptation to climates, and prevention of diseases, to name a few. However, my diatribe is not against clothing itself, but rather the prohibition of public nudity. To stretch this idea further, we could even include the restraint placed on children, by parents, from viewing sex or nudity in any form. It seems to me that the whole subject boils down to the concern for the healthy development of children in our society. There seems to be an inherent unquestioned belief in our cultural program that viewing nudity and sex is detrimental to children. This is where I would like to gain perspective from the rich database of Nexian knowledge. So here are some questions to spark discussion:

1)What are your views on this whole subject? Feel free to offer any criticisms you feel obliged to. I would appreciate it deeply.

2)Hypothetically speaking, do you believe that the sanction of public nudism across the globe would have a detrimental or beneficial outcome?

3)Should children be allowed to view nudity and sex, in person (i.e. watching their parents have sex) and/or on screens? Why or why not? I believe that the current porn industry puts out content that can be highly detrimental, especially to the malleable mind of a child during critical phases of neuro-development and worldview-development. However, the question I am posing is in relation to “appropriate depictions” of sex that are closer to reality; not gangbang videos involving sadomasochism and depreciation of women which the mainstream porn industry promotes.

4)What is it about nudity and sexuality that so intimidates most cultures across the globe? Why is flesh still a taboo? What are the pros and cons?

Feel free to answer to more questions than listed above. I would absolutely love to hear anything anyone has to say on this subject! Thank you so much for taking the time to read this lengthy post; I am grateful for all your precious time. Take care my friends

I believe children are only "shocked" by nudity, because sexuality is generally repressed in our culture, even though it's on display 24/7. It seems counterintuitive, but if ad agencies use sex to sell, it is completely detached from the realities of regular sexual intercourse and reduced to merely provide visual stimuly to entice consumers to buy. Also, the idea that the body needs to be overcome is not a new one and spawns from well before christianity and has certainly contributed to our views of the naked body. Sexuality is regarded as "dirty" and children are "innocent" and "pure" ...right? Yes they are, in the sense that they're not spoilt by ridiciolous and arbitrary customs. It is pure satire to consider that protecting kids from nudity is in fact not preserving their innocence but spoiling them by reproducing the myth, that the body and ...sexuality is something hidden, dark....and yes, dirty.

The sad reality is, that many kids are indeed negatively impacted by nudity because they've already internalize that this is something bad they ought not see.

Change the culture first and then we can wander around freely with our genitals out.
Perhaps public nudity can be part of that cultural change, but i don't know what degree. I certainly won't visit the mall in the nude.

as a nudist, I am all for it. I have spent a great deal of time at a nude beach and made some of my greatest friends there. I know people there who go with children all the time. It's only weird for those people who are raised to be ashamed or think it's weird. I felt weird the first time at a nude beach too..and I know others who just cant do it. When you really think about it, it's weird to have some issue with being naked.

Here in San Francisco, public nudity was, up until recently, legal almost everywhere. There was a community of naturists, mostly men, whose members would hang out in various parts of the city on nice days. Always great for the tourists ;-)

Unfortunately, things have been getting more conservative here. One of the places they loved to hang out a lot was the Castro, and the supervisor for that district is a dick. Basically a republican in democrats clothing. He successfully got legislation banning public nudity through city council.

While that was underway, there was tons of (not very intelligent) discussion and debate on the topic. As far as I could tell, anti-nude supporters of the law had no cogent arguments besides "we don't like it". That was compelling enough for the supervisor. Of course all of the usual bogus hygiene and "think of the children" arguments were trotted around ad nauseum.

you know what i think is weird when I was growing up looking at national geographic magazines and watching nature shows native people were topless with a cloth skirt
only bottoms were barley covered now same shows same magazines same tribes wearing our clothes...???

Now if they want to make a change and wear a reg t shirt that is fine with me but it kinda has the feel that these women have to wear them to be on tv some instances the shirts look too new and clean to be old shirts

I believe in openly nakedness should be a bit more open then closed off us women in Canada are aloud to go topless but I still see men topless and women not !! with men not being use to seeing us topless every day this could be an issue car accidents and such (have we hid them that long that we would cause a car accident if we took our boobies out?

my view on porn sex I don't want my boys watching that but I am sure being teenagers they probably have already, and I have already discussed with them that porn is not what real women are like, so dont expect a girl friend to do thoes things.

I am open with my boys about sex explaining all the things I think I should even if it is embarrassing to talk about.
I do anyway I started age related material when they were babies, like with little ones they manage to touch themselves or brush up against teddy bears

lol its great when u have company lol so I explained to them it is fine to touch yourselves but this is meant to be a private thing for u and your alone time. After a bit they didnt do it in front of company anymore lol, but they are not afraid to do what they want in private.

In today's age with all the std's and such being open and honest about sex the good old talk if your good at it it never ends

growing up I was embarrassed to discuss sex with my parents but I had an Aunt and a Grandma to fill me in. For some reason I couldnt talk to my mom she has always been uptight when it comes to sex, she has been abused as a young teenager her 1st experience was torture not love so her and these issues made me grow up uptight and not knowing anything about sex

Now these r my freeing dayz I am nude on another site a lot I find this time in my life I finally love my body see it as a beautiful thing something that is not perfect but that is the fun part
... Not looking like a super model and still having a fun time showing it off in an artistic way.
It has helped me over come my own past abuse I feel free from it in a weird way it is something that is really hard to explain but I know it is a natural part of life and I like to show my fellow ladies that even if they are not perfect they are still very beautiful they do not have to fight to look like a super model to be beautiful

lol oh ya quick Q r we aloud to be nakid here?

But a couple of days are still exceptions, right?



Yeah, that's kinda sexist. I germany, "exhibitionism" is a CRIME if a man participates. Women are allowed to be naked all the time, everywhere...ok, it'S at least not a criminal offense but i think it can be a misdemenor. I believe this is because this law was written by men, who don't mind naked women in public.

What is striking to me, is that (female) nudity is instantly associated with sex. (It certainly is for me for an extend I don't like) It's probably a self perpetuating process, since almost all situations where we encounter naked bodies are intimate or pornographic. IMO a very unhealthy situation. But sexuality in general seems very unhealthy in our society. I think about 1 in every 4 women will experience seaxual violence, if I remember that number right... And because it's taboo, the victims usually don't talk about it.

Same with children. Nobody talks about sex enough, so children don't get good guidelines how to behave when intimate with others. All most of them know is some third grade sexual education, maybe one or two talks with their parents if they're lucky and all the porn the web has to offer... And they certainly don't see the people they like in their real life naked very often.

All that really needs a shift in a better direction. Like so many things in western countries.

I begin to think that this whole "free love" thing has something to it.

I would encourage you all to go spend some time in nudist circles..go to some nude beaches or something. You will find out pretty fast how deep your own projections run. It takes a while to get used to that to the point where you are comfortable walking around among strangers with these appendages we all have flapping in the wind etc. It's a beautiful thing. It took me some time to be able to just feel normal standing on a crowded beach naked. It's good for you.

I rarely get to any nude beaches these days, but it feels freeing when I do. I should go more. I used to go almost every day.

Thanks for all the replies so far everyone! I will break my responses into separate posts since this makes it easier to answer.

Indeed, superficial simulations of sex are on display 24/7, and yet more authentic forms of sexuality are repressed. It seems to me that there is an inherent longing to return to a primal sense of sexuality (commensurate to McKenna's viewpoints); however, this longing remains unsatisfied in our current culture, and perhaps lurks in the subconscious psyche. Perhaps this is why advertisers are able to lure the masses into consumerism via portrayals of sexual stimuli. Why else would objectification of flesh seem so enticing?


I wonder where the origin of sexual taboos first formed, and why. Any speculations?
Yes, the notion of protecting kids from sexual depictions does seem silly. Perhaps allowing them to watch their parents have sex would be an answer to proper sex education...just like in the good old tribal days. What views do you guys hold on this? Perhaps some might be concerned about children's arousal towards their parents. What are the pros and cons here?


Indeed, it is not the nudity, but rather the meaning which the cultural programs ascribe to nudity. Changing the culture first would indeed make it easier to visit the mall nude, and Naturism is a great way to take the initial steps. But what degree of public nudity should be incorporated into our culture, and what steps can we take towards that direction?
Thank you for your interesting insights obliguhl, I'm enjoying this discussion

I had a similar first experience, wherein I felt alienated from the clothed crowd, and felt like a spectacle being judged; probably also because I was the only one naked at this rather conservative "nude beach." I think naturist parents instill unique perceptions on the subject of nudity and sexuality in their children via public nudity, and that the world would benefit from more such conduct. I wonder what the pros and cons are here though. I am aiming to address a wide range of responses from my audience when I give the speech, and am therefore trying to understand various facets of this subject. Keep it swingin jamie


Very cool! I used to reside in the Bay Area, and never knew of this.


I will look further into this. I wonder if there has ever been a single intelligent discussion on the subject. I would love to understand the logical rationale and justification of anti-nudists.

Ha! never thought about that one. Perpetuation of nonsense demands maintenance of antiquated norms.


I still don't understand that...Its not women's tits that must be covered, but rather the nipples! The only difference between male and female nipples is lactation or lack thereof. Why do female nipples arouse, and male nipples don't?


To add to that, like I mentioned in my response to obliguhl, I think that the reason porn sells is because of our longing to indulge in flesh in a manner that has been forgotten. Porn industry capitalizes on this desire and longing which lurks in the human psyche to reconnect with our sexuality, and in turn, with all of humanity.


haha, awesome, we need more teddy bears! I think that's a great initiative in the right direction.


Yes, it is very intuitive that naturism enhances our self-image, body-perception, and our worldviews. It feels more human.


Yes! post some nudies, even if there's a forest down there


Perhaps if women ceased to exist, men wouldn't concern themselves with the prohibition of public nudity anymore. It seems that these laws are patriarchal in essence; but I wonder what drives the repression of matriarchal sexuality...

I think it was Robert Anton Wilson who said that humans dress from the neck down so as to forget we are domesticated apes, because the nude body is the most animalistic thing about being human. I always thought that was a funny way to look at it.

Or to have (satisfying?) Sex at all.



I doubt it, because most people believe that children do not have any kind of sexuality...
How to deal with that sexuality is a cultural thing and differs...

In my mind, the fierceful stance angainst the body and sensuality in general stems from plato and those who adapted this view later on. From Grand Philosophers to Christianity which certainly needed fuel to battle against the indigenous cultures of europe (witches, heathens, barbarics etc etc...). It's funny though, that this initial impulse to prosecute "heretics" came from the general population itself. Why? There are many speculations. Some assume that around 1000 there was a myth which said that jews would poison the wells and that they were comissioned by some secret arabic king...while in reality, there was a great fear of leper. It is funny how these cultural myths never seem to die. Anyways, a couple of hundred years later, the war against the body was in full swing. One of the main reasons why witches had to die was the fact that they, presumably, had sex with the devil who posessed a regular man during intercourse.

There was this idea that females were INSATISFIABLE...and would even have sex with the devil. Now we have a nice portion of misogyny mixed in. But as we know, the church had to formerly declare females "human" after some discussion.... This stance against female sexuality might still have a stronghold in so called "slut shaming" by female peers - but it appears that the tables have turned and now it'S mens time to suffer. After all, men are horndogs, right? INSATISFIABLE - and their "aggressive sexuality" is in truth some sort of devils play (a fight against female emancipation).

As i said, it's funny how cultural patterns and myths are able to survive centuries just to be repeated again...and again...and yet again.

I know my mom protected me from sex repressed ... sometimes it felt as if she was smothering me to protect me .... so I wouldnt have to experience the pain she felt
but with all her protection I still was sexually abused 1st time I was around 4 years old this was the hardest time to understand, it is still confusing seeing it threw a child's eyes ...having this as my 1st memory of sex and being repressed as a kid was a very unhealthy outlook for a long time with sex
I still look at sex as bad dirty but I have a great hubby now that is teaching me how loving it can be
I wont be letting my boys watch thats for sure we dont live in shared accommodation that way anymore we have rooms and dividers (walls) to block us all up dont know if this is a good or bad thing
My youngest almost walked in on me and hubby not too long ago it was kinda funny and I think we did well we stopped him b4 he came in the room and he left but we had a talk to him after cause he was confused why we wouldnt let him come in the room "what were u doing?" well we didnt lie why lie? Hubby told him we were having sex he got embarrassed a little but we told him that's what couples do when they r in love there is nothing wrong with that

We see it all day people selling stuff this way makes a ton of money but we get embarrassed when confronted with it yes I do think we have gone too far hiding our nature but working threw this embarrassment is the way forward many adults never have the sex talk with their kids too embarrassed but this is way worse on the kid than a little embarrassment

@inaniel: Robert Wilson always has interesting things to say on the subject, similar to McKenna! He mentioned the fourth sexual circuit in considerable detail in Prometheus Rising...I read it a long time ago though, and don't remember much. I gotta dig that book up now..

@WildEdibles: I'm glad that sex is serving as therapeutic for you, and that you are moving in the direction of your choosing. Its good to talk with your children with such openness, and I commend your decisions!

@obliguhl: Interesting points...so witches were condemned out of ignorance and made-up folklore, and the deviant nudism they practiced served as a major catalyst to classify them as outcasts, to be eradicated from society. Indeed cultural norms senselessly multiply throughout ages before dying out.

I've been thinking about other concerns that anti-nudists might have regarding public nudity, and the list so far is such:
1. Children are neurologically unprepared for it.
2. Children might feel arousal towards their parents (which you, obliguhl, just addressed)
4. It leads to lust, which leads to increased sexual activity, which may further lead to polygamy, and extra-marital affairs.
5. Children will begin thinking in sexual terms since a younger age, and therefore have sex at younger ages.
6. People, especially women, might experience increased sexual harassment
7. Religions claim that bare flesh invites temptation and therefore is a doorway to "sin."

Can any of you guys refute, and provide a solution, to any of the points above (especially #4)? It will be helpful to provide solutions/answers to the counterpoints that my audience makes during my speech. I would like to gain more perspective so that I can prepare an effective persuasive speech. Although I have my own ideas on how to address these counterpoints, I would like to hear more opinions on this.

I think if we went from no nudity to total nudity over night I think there would be a ton of different feelings lust be one discussed be another ... and ya very open to harassment but both men and women might be harassed not just women

I don't think kids would lust for their parents just by seeing them naked but they might lust after peers

I do think that seeing sex more as a child tho might bring them into sex sooner long long ago we were having sex younger married off b4 really u were an adult ... now we try and prolong that with our children them getting into sex hopefully later at least a teenager or young adult

If we gradually moved into nudity it be a different story a more mature outlook like what happens in nudist colonies

the way we are set up with all the sex sells I don't think we could have a mature outlook on sex ...selling anything with a half naked lady on it ...what would happen if she was totally nude ... it might loose the tease to it and thus the appeal

I would not put it quite this way. European history is just full of examples i which the body was treated as potentially "evil". The fact that a couple of sexual practices such as anal, masturbation etc were used to prosecute those who think differently (heretics) shows that the war against the body was used as a political instrument. You could say that by fighting against "sodomists" the church was able to hold their position of power. Ironically, the persecuition of heretics and later witches wasn't some sort of grandiose plan initiated by the church to broaden their base of power....the people wanted it.

Today, the term sodomy still exists. In the US it still means anal sex, while in germany for instance, it has been reduced to "sex with animals". Still, there is a fight against deviating sexual practices.

Well then, the situation today is a bit different if we compare Europe with the US. The US has its own little anti-body culture which probably stems with the early influx of radical christians who still hold a lot of political and cultural power. It's not a rare thing to see children playing naked in germany and especially the "naked bike ride" scene is kind of thriving. There is also a inofficial nudist area in the local park. Not too sure if something like this exists in the bible belt.

A couple of years ago i was invited out for a days sailing in the Med with an old couple (Bob and Cynthia) who lived in the next village to me. We motored out of the harbour and i volunteered to go down to the galley and prepare a pot of tea.

Once the tea was prepared i mounted the stairs with the pot and i was greeted by the sight of Bobs hairy arse as he bent over to adjust his rigging. Both he and Cynthia had taken their clothes off and proceeded to explain to me that they were naked sailors. I am ashamed to say that i was a little freaked out but managed to enjoy the day (i kept my trunks on).

I have always thought that there are some things that shouldn"t be seen and Bob"s wrinkly ballsack bouncing between his thighs is one of them. Although that sight will no doubt stay with me untill the day i die.

I would be very interested to hear peoples thoughts on naked old people (and old people having sex) and the concept of the body beautiful.

I have no problem with people going naked but i think that i am too traumatised about my wiry coathanger excuse for a body and probably would never publicly go naked. I also like the idea of being naked with just one person. They see you naked and you see them naked but no one else does. It helps to heighten an intimate moment.

Also with the public nakedness thing , from a man"s point of view, how do people feel about walking around while engorged. Erections can happen at inopportune moments. And if it"s ok to walk around with wood, would it be ok to masturbate in front of people? Where do you draw the line?

hey people , you know i am all for nudity

go naked everyone , especially the girls

and have sex in public people , no need to feel shy , i like it