Hi all,
Been skulking around these forums for sometime, never really posting anything. I been working with DMT for about a decade and in the last year have also began working with Salvinorin-A.
These two substances have become my greatest allies. As many of you know, they are very different from each other but I wanted to deeply explore how whilst being as objective as possible. There are alot of misconceptions with Salvia, but as I began working with it much later then I did with DMT I think that helped me see it differently.

One could simply call Salvia as "The experience of the lower and fundamental architecture and processes behind consciousness, mind and consequently reality".

In my experience, the effects and hallucinations of Salvia differ greatly from substances of equally intense nature such as DMT. In contrast to DMT, which always felt cosmic, alien or a higher dimension of consciousness, the “salvia space” appeared almost polar opposite. This left me with the impression that it is something fundament real and extremely close to normal existence. Like it exists just behind the curtain of the consensus model and is deeply connected to it, or the consensus model is imbedded within.

Let me try to explain…

DMT as it begins to take over awareness, floods the mind with new information. A basic description could be, transforming geometric hallucinations growing in vividness and complexity until they eventually reach a point in which the consensus model of reality is “overwhelmed”. This gives the impression one has ‘broken through” into a new dimension as these geometric hallucinations form elaborate alien constructs, spaces and beings which are independent of the consensus model. In my experience it feels as though I am submerged into a pool of water (i.e., water being this geometric dimension) which dissolves me of my regular awareness.

With salvia it’s much more difficult to explain, you are not submerged in water but rather you become the water.

Another analogy which I find helpful is thinking of existence or consensus reality as film playing out on a television or a movie set. Salvia seems to disrupt the neurological processes maintaining the film, resulting in the experience of the wires, processes and architecture “behind the scenes”. This gives the impression that one has caused mind/reality to collapse or the film to come to an end, which as a result begins disassembling back into its fundamental mechanical architecture. It feels as though my mind is transforming into something else rather than mind entering something else.

To contrast this with DMT, I don’t feel myself leaving my body in a sort of spirited or energetic sort of way, or my consciousness dissolving into a more pure and unified form
Rather it feels as one’s consciousness is collapsing into more fundamental and abstract dimensions of itself. I find DMT leaves self and mental processes mostly intact, in a way that I am still cognitively myself. This leads to an experience that one is immersed within another dimension but is experiencing the visionary content like looking at it with eyes or hearing it with ears (even though they are not). While with salvia, I am not “seeing” something, I don’t see anything at all as I am not separate from the experience. Instead, my mind becomes the hallucinations, architecture and machinescapes, sort of like a hypervivid daydream or intense mental imagery rather than visuals. You FEEL and BECOME the hyperdimensional architecture, as if the construction or fundamental blueprint of mind itself transforms and dissembles into an abstract machinescape, along with normal mental processing and sense of self.

This mindscape/machinescape dimension which I refer to as “the factory” (as many others do as well) has a plot and nature which feels incredibly familiar, as well as having a simple, child-like and cartoon aesthetic. It is strange and twisted almost comical, containing the entities resembling ominous clowns or tricksters performing some sort of hyperdimensional and abstract processing within the fundamental architectural dimensional behind existence.

One has a "physical" form in this dimension, something which is abstract and alien, but simultaneously extremely familiar. As the mind disassembles so does the perceived physical form, reverting back to some basic fundamental blueprint of itself, something which is a part and imbedded within this dimension. I would not necessarily say I am no longer human; it almost feels I become something more human than human. A sort of plastic figurine “toy” with no complex thought and understanding, an empty shell or mechanical blueprint of humanity. A body without a mind being “processed” within this architectural dimension (e.g., flattened to 2-dimensions and rolled up, twisted into shapes which fit into machines).

Unlike DMT, the experience lacks lucidity, and separation. This is due to mind and self-transforming, becoming and merging into the architecture and narrative, as the model of reality and existence is stripped away. Thus, thoughts and feelings which are experienced are not your own but rather the result of this entirely new state of existence and dimension of consciousness. Self goes through hyperdimensional fragmentation, deforming and transforming into something else.

One could describe the state as dream-like, similar in the way that plots within dreams are believable and often are independent or disconnected from reality. The salvia state is similar in the way it pulls the mind disassembles into an extremely strange and abstract situation and plot which is fully accepted as truth. However, it also differs to dreams in the way it manifests. In my experience reality is not simply replaced like in dream (e.g., one film ends, and another begins). Rather it explores an intermediate state between films, the dissembling of existence/life or like I have described here, the wires, functions and processes behind the show. This often manifests as experiencing the consensus model of mind being processed, transformed and disassembling into a more fundamental factory dimension behind it (as if it was all built from it). As if your awareness expanded out from the film on the TV to see that it was a product of the machinery within, or the film is ending, and the set is being taken apart.

Similar to DMT, this mindscape is inhabited. Beings and intelligences orchestrate and organise the processes and phenomena. I never recall “seeing” these entities clearly like I do on DMT. They appear to be the only things separate from myself. I become the hyperdimensional architecture, but they and their machines are not part of it but rather they are the ones that processes it. The factory workers processing the fundamental fabric of existence. They appear extremely large, non-humanoid, shadowy and genderless. They seem clownish and trickster-like, usually communicating in a chanting-singing rhythm which correlates with the mechanical motions and processing they control. They seem to be critical to the function and maintenance of this dimension, playing a direct role in the assembly, organisation, manipulation and disassembly of one’s existence here. The factory workers of the fundamental architecture behind consciousness, reality, and existence. Our lives are parts of their machinery and things they are processing. The maintenance workers and intelligences which manage the wires, processes and functions in the set which sustains the show.

It was interesting to read your analysis. Thank you! It is definitely an interpretation that I will keep in mind (always considering that no one will ever know what all this really is).

However, I made a doubtful expression when I read this part:

I am especially doubtful about the manipulation. This makes me think of an intentional influence on our lives, with a purpose behind it. Do you think this? Or do you think that this influence is more of a systemic kind and that the consequences of their influence in our lives are more of something that it depends on the interaction between our choices and "their rules"? To explain me better: if you throw a glass on the ground and it breaks, do you give the responsibility to gravity or to your choice to throw it on the ground? If you put the responsibility on gravity, it is as if you are attributing an intention to it.
You know the existence of gravity, and you know what would have happened if you had done that action. Taking for granted, therefore, that what you say is true with respect to the key role of these entities on the functioning of our reality, I would say that maybe we have not yet discovered and understood these "laws" and therefore we are not yet aware that the reaction to a certain action it will be a certain consequence. This leads us to attribute an intention to the consequence, because we cannot understand why something happened.

Wow!! That was extremely well-articulated. A very apt description of Salvia. I would agree with basically everything you so eloquently stated.

"Simply," indeed! Hah. But yes, well put.

And also, it is so much more than that. As you said, it is inhabited as well. There is Life within this realm. Though it works through opening the gateways into our consciousness, the plant spirit opens us up to a very beautiful realm--opening us up to new dimensions, deeper dimensions of beauty. What with a cleansed perception of ... perception, we are able to see into deeper shades of the colors of the Earth and our connection to it.

Very interesting read, its really nice of you to share that perspective on the substances. Salvia is something I had a very short 'honeymoon' with many years ago, then abandoned without ever planning on considering it again. Now that I have explored psychedelics and spirituality much more, and approach substances from a different perspective I wonder if I would be able to draw out the entheogenic nature of salvia, or if I would still struggle to get anything out of the experience. I still don't think I will be seeking out salvia yet, but its something I will be keeping in the back of my mind.

Thank you for the kind words.
Regarding this I am not fully sure you could refer to these beings as sentient like the beings found on DMT (although the argument can be made for them as well). Their nature seems robotic, mechanical and focused on orchestrating a particular mechanical function/process whereas those on DMT tend to interact with you in a more “human” way. They could very well be something akin to a cell organelles, which may appear sentient but have a very restricted mechanical function involved in maintaining and processing the architecture of consciousness. This sort of fits with what they appear to be doing, as they are not directly interacting with you but rather "turning gears which are part of the architecture and the architecture is mind". So based on this i don't think they influence the way the "game" is played but maybe keep the games code running.

Dr Andrew Gallimore explores a similar concept in his book "Alien information theory". However that hypothesizes they are higher sentient beings, while I think Salvia is dealing with a lower dimension of consciousness therefore are more "mechanical"

Rather than refer to them as "mechanical," which is a word often used to describe DMT entities as well, I would describe the Salvia entities as animal. Beasts of the underworld, perhaps. Which is why most people fear Salvia.

Salvia = underworld = animal = basic = familiar

DMT = celestial realm = alien = refined = foreign

EDIT: Animals are in a sense mechanistic, but not in an artificial way; rather, in a more Earthly / desire-driven way. The aliens or "higher" entities are more driven by consciousness, detachment, and domination/control.

now I understand very well what you mean, thanks for the explanation!
The last thing that comes to my mind is: isn't it that we humans take human-centered things as signs of being sentient? I'm not trying to question your experience at all, I want it to be clear. I have never even tried Salvia, and in fact you could say "try and see" and you would be right.


This analogy of yours is also very interesting. Let's say if they were so familiar maybe there wouldn't be all this fear haha
I think it depends a lot on how you interpret the human condition, above all. Are we enlightened beasts? or are we downgraded gods?
In fact, it is precisely with DMT that many speak of an incredible feeling of familiarity. In the end, it's all very subjective.

I think sentience (in this context) is when something displays characteristics that seem autonomous and independent of the greater flow of things. So in a way they appear both simultaneously sentient and not, somewhere in between where it is difficult to call them one or the other.
The entities on DMT however, I do not struggle to call them sentient or autonomous, as their appearance and nature is recognised as such.
I also like to think of salvia entities as bees and the "hive" being the machinescape (or mindscape). Now when we think of bees, we know they are individuals, with their own ability to navigate and interact with the environment (i.e., autonomy). But we also know they are driven by a hive mind, and have very specific purposes in which they are assigned in regards to the maintaining and sustaining the hive (i.e., mechanical).
So based on this we could call bees both mechanical and autonomous, just like the way these entities appear within this "hive".

It is incredibly difficult to explain and I don't think I can truly do it justice but I really like this points you are raising, they are making me think more deeply about this.

And I like your always exhaustive answers!