Not lime juice, “hydrated lime” as in calcium hydroxide. It's a base. It helps it absorb better, faster. SWIM uses the resin without the lime usually. He uses it sublingually and doesn’t usually snort it. Either way he finds 250 mg to be a very effective, but light, psychedelic dose. Either way, it helps if you can grind the resin to a fine powder.

When snorting, the lime really helps. Use about 4 parts resin to one part lime. Grind them together, add a tiny bit of water after grinding it, just enough to make it feel wet, but not be watery. Mix and let it dry at room temperature. Grind it again. This process freebases the alkaloids and the lime helps the alkaloids absorb through the nasal passages.

You can take 20 mg of harmine, THH, or caapi copy sublingually with it, or 10 mg of harmaline. Usually you take these about 10 minutes beforehand. Snorting also works. SWIM doesn’t like snorting anything because it makes him feel sick, but most people get stronger effects from snorting it.

Adding THH will not increase the potency, but adding caapi copy, harmine, or harmaline will roughly double the potency. THH produces the nicest trip with it. All 4 of these extend the trip about 2-3 times and make the experience far more DMT-like. Normally 5-MeO-DMT doesn’t produce much visuals, but when combined with one of these harmala alkaloids, the visual effects are greatly enhanced.

thank you a lot 69ron, I just asked this in another forum but what about any experiences rectally?

I've read about people using other chemicals this way at lower doses, those chemicals are a lot more widely used than the stuff we are taking about I think, THH and the resin. So i'm not sure if someone has takin them that way, I was thinking of putting it in a gel tab and doing it rectally lol.

It should work well. I don't know about using a gel tab though. The gel tab might not dissolve, and that would mess everything up.

Can anyone give SWIM a technique for smoking Virola resin freebase? SWIM is using Calcium Hydroxide and water (as per this thread) to create the freebase, but hasn't been able to find any recommendations as to how it should be smoked. Does it need to be vaporized like DMT freebase, or can it just be fired up and smoked like any other plant material?

If it needs to be vaporized, how similar is the boiling point to DMT (i.e. more heat or less heat)? Will the resin freebase melt into an oil like DMT freebase? SWIM would like to give this a shot tonight or tomorrow, so a quick reply would make SWIM eternally grateful! SWIM has a limited amount and would like to start at a lower dose and work his way up, so any knowledge transfer that will help him waste less is very much appreciated!

Peace and thanks!
-idt

There are two virola resins that are popular. One is Virola theiodora and the other is Virola calophylla. They are both very different. Virola theiodora contains mostly 5-MeO-DMT, while Virola calophylla contains mostly DMT.

Smoking 5-MeO-DMT is similar to DMT, but it boils at a slightly higher temperature, but the exact boiling point is unknown.

It melts to an oil like DMT before it vaporizes. But in the resin, you're probably not going to see it melt. SWIM has NOT tried smoking any resin. He doesn't like the effects of smoked 5-MeO-DMT at all, unless the dose is very low. He doesn't much care for smoked DMT either. He prefers both taken sublingually.

I have NO IDEA what the potency is for smoked resin. Most people haven't been able to get it to work that way and I don't know why.

One thing, if it doesn't work the first shot, wait 15 minutes before trying again. You can smoke 5-MeO-DMT once every 15 minutes, but not sooner. Also, you need to get it all in one inhalation more so than with DMT because you build up tolerance to 5-MeO-DMT super fast.

I wish I could be of more help.

Thanks ron - Sorry, I should have been clearer. Virola Theiodora is what I'm referring to. So, you think even if SWIM freebases it with Calcium Hydroxide that it wont melt? I guess SWIM will just go with a vaporization tech and see how it works out. If anyone has actually tried this please let me know.

I don't really know.

Let us know how it goes. I'm very curious about this.

ron, so the virola theiodora resin can be used as is sublingually? swims never tried anything sublingually and was wondering if you could shed some light on the best way to go about it. Its also swims first time experimenting with 5-meo so he plans on treading lightly.

The dosage used for snuff and for sublingual use is the same.

With Virola theiodora resin the starting dose is 500-1000 mg. You mix that with 6% calcium hydroxide by weight for optimal effects.

When using it sublingually, most people find the quid method easiest to use. What you do is grind the resin with the calcium hydroxide, then add a little water, just enough to make it like clay. You roll it into a tablet like shape. If there’s not enough water it just comes apart. If there’s too much water, it also comes apart. Getting the amount of water right takes a little practice. When it’s right it’s sort of like clay and can be molded into a lablet shape. You want it long, not a ball shape, more like a gelatin capsule shape.

You put the tablet it in your cheek and slowly suck on it for about 10-15 minutes. Don’t allow any saliva to build up in your mouth or it won’t work. Suck slowly to prevent saliva build up. It’ll eventually break apart in your mouth. Try to keep it in your cheek. After 10-15 minutes you can spit it out.

The other option is to put the powder directly under your tongue and press your tongue down on it. As with the cheek method, slowly suck on it. Keep your tongue pressed down on it to keep the resin there. Hold it for about 10-15 minutes and then you can spit it out.

You can swallow it if you like. The amount of calcium hydroxide used for 1000 mg is only 60 mg. You can safely ingest up to 1000 mg of calcium hydroxide per day. It’s actually a great calcium supplement. It turns into calcium chloride in the stomach. The average person eats between 160-345 mg of calcium chloride per day.

thanks ron, as always appreciate the information, help and experience.

Hey 69 - Can you clarify something for me? In earlier posts it was suggested to use a 4:1 (resin:Ca(OH)2) to freebase the resin, but in the highlighted segment above you suggest 6% Ca(OH)2, so 25% VS 6%. So now SWIM is a little confused. If SWIM was freebasing for smoking, which would be a better rule of thumb to follow? Thanks man!

Peace
-idt

That previous ratio of 4:1 of resin to calcium hydroxide is an old figure SWIM just copied from other SWIMs. It's inaccurate and it's by volume. Volume measures are inherently inaccurate for things like resin.

The new 6% number is the amount of calcium hydroxide to add by weight of the resin. This new number is based on SWIM's own personal trial and error for use as snuff or as a quid (or sublingual). He did several tests at various different ratios (10 mg calcium hydroxide to 1000 mg resin, then 20 to 1000, then 30, etc.) and found this to be the best ratio. Any more and the calcium hydroxide starts to burn your mouth, and doesn't really make it any more effective. Any less and the snuff is much less effective.

For Virola theiodora resin, this is not that critical because you don't really need calcium hydroxide for 5-MeO-DMT to absorb properly, but it helps boost the potency a little.

For Virola calophylla resin this is absolutely critical, because calcium hydroxide is required or it won't work well at all. That's been SWIM's experience anyway. DMT works much better when the mouth or nose is made alkaline with calcium hydroxide.

Now this pertains solely to snuff and quids made from the resin. This is not for freebasing. When making snuff or a quid, it's important that calcium hydroxide be present because it helps the alkaloids absorb through the nasal and buccal mucosa. In this case it's enough if only 40-50% of the alkaloids are freebased at any given moment. You don't need all the alkaloids freebased because they will still all get absorbed as freebase after a few minutes. You need a pH of about 9, that's it. Any more and you're overdoing it.


When freebasing for smoking, you need 100% of the alkaloids freebased, so the pH needs to be higher than the pKa of the alkaloid in question. For DMT the pKa is 8.68 so you need a pH of 11.68 to freebase 99% of it. So you need a lot more calcium hydroxide to get the pH up that high. I don't know the amount by weight but a 4:1 ratio of resin to calcium hydroxide should be more than enough to do it.

Excellent ron! That clears things up a ton! Thank's for the quick reply. SWIM shall report back soon! He's just trying to find the proper window of free time to prepare and experiment. So much research and so little time!!

Peace
-idt

Got home form work today to find a little envelope with some bags of resin... quite excited to try this stuff soon, got both Virola calophylla and theiodora, think I will try calophylla first as 5-meo sounds like it can be a bit hardcore... thanks for info ron, I think I will try mixing 1g with 60mg calcium hydroxide.

This makes me curious. My friend has resin from a well known Harmala extractor.
Maybe she will try some caapi copy and make up a solution.

I mixed 3g of Virola theiodora resin with the 4:1 ratio of resin to sodium carbonate.

When I added water to make it wet, I noticed a smell. Is that normal? Is that the alkaloids freebasing?

Also, for anyone that has tried smoking this, how did you do it? I'm thinking of just a bong with no water and torching it, but I don't know if I should have to vaporize it somehow. Any thoughts?