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Harmine = Telepathine, sources please : ) Options
 
Coma
#1 Posted : 12/16/2018 12:22:18 AM
Hi I'm new here and and want to write about Ayahuasca. Can anyone provide me with a source on Harmine being termed Telepathine in 1932 ? I would like to know if it was actually Harmine that was isolated and termed or if it was a mixture of harmine, harmaline and thh that was mistakingly taken for one chemical Thank you : )

Steve Beyers "singing to the plants" chapter 22 Is my best source so far..
 
downwardsfromzero
ModeratorChemical expert
#2 Posted : 12/16/2018 11:16:50 AM
From J. Ott, "Ayahuasca Analogues":
Quote:
The phytochemical study of ayahuasca lianas and potions commenced in the first decade of the twentieth century, when in 1905 a Colombian chemist, Rafael Zerda Bayon, isolated an amorphous preparation fronm a yaje potion that he called telepatina or telepathine [Zerda Bayon 1915]. Eighteen years were to pass before fellow Colombian chemist G. Fischer Cardenas, in his doctoral thesis, reported the isolation of crystalline material of Zerda Bayon's telepatina from plant material of yaje, which he believed to be a species of Aristolochia[...] [Fischer Cardenas 1923]. The following year, H. Seil and E. Putt reported the results of a "preliminary" examination of caapi, plant material they called Banisteria caapi - the isolation of three impure alkaloids [Seil & Putt 1924]. A year later, the Colombian chemist A.M. Barriga Villalba reported the isolation of two alkaloids, yaheina and yahenina from yaje plant matter he'd identified as Prestonia [Haemadictyon] amazonica, also mentioned in another doctoral dissertation published that year in Bogota, by Colombian chemist L. Albarracin [Albarracin 1925; Barriga Villalba 1925a, 1925b].

After this pioneering work in Colombia, the scene shifted to Europe, and in 1926, Europeans E. Clinquart and M. Michiels likewise reported isolation of yaheine and yahenine from plant samples identified asPrestonia amazonica [Clinquart 1926; Michiels & Clinquart 1926]. The situation clarified somewhat the following year, when E. Perrot and Raymond-Hamet reported the equivalence of telepathine and yageine, which they isolated from Banisteria caapi [Perrot & Raymond-Hamet 1927a,1927b], but was again muddied the following year when famed German chemist Louis Lewin published his isolation of banisterin from yaje material he had obtained from the Merck company and also called Banisteria caapi [Lewin 1928, 1929]. Lewin's colleagues at Merck, K. Rumpf and O. Wolfes, and Swiss chemist F. Elger began to clarify matters considerably, when they reported that Zerda Bayon's and Fischer Cardenas' telepatina, Barriga Villalba's and Albarracin's yajeina, and Lewin's banisterin were all equivalent to harmine, a conclusion seconded by three other groups the following year [Brückl & Mussgnug 1929; Dalmer 1929; Elger 1928; Keller & Gottauf 1929; Wolfes & Rumpf 1928]. As though unawrae of these advances in distant Europe, a South American thesis from Peru a decade later revived the concepts yajeina and yajenina for alkaloids isolated from B. caapi [Arispe 1938]. All these studies suffered, however, from a lack of botanical voucher specimens to back up the botanical names associated with this chemical work.

Finally, in 1939, chemists A.L. and K.K. Chen, working with botanical material collected by botanist Llewellyn Williams near Iquitos, Peru and definitively identified as Bannisteriopsis caapi, showed that telepathine, yajeine ans banisterine were in fact identical to harmine [Chen & Chen 1939; Williams 1931]. These researchers were able to isolate harmine from stems, leaves and roots of the documente B. caapi sample. Elger had already convincingly established identity of telepathine, yajeine and banisterine with harmine, by comparing crystalline harmine isolated from Banisteriopsis with synthetic harmine and harmine he isolated from Peganum harmala [Elger 1928]. This well-knowwn alkaloid had been isolated from Syrian rue, Peganum harmala, by German chemist J. Fritzsche midway through the nineteenth century [Fritzsche 1847][...]


I'll add a bit more about the other caapi alkaloids later.




“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Aum_Shanti
#3 Posted : 12/16/2018 11:46:59 AM
In this relation, I can also recommend Ott's Pharmacotheon. Especially in regard of writing a work about Ayahuasca.

Here is a thread about sourcing it online: https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&m=406223#post406223
I claim not that this is the truth. As this is just what got manifested into my mind at the current position in time on this physical plane. So please feel not offended by anything I say.
 
downwardsfromzero
ModeratorChemical expert
#4 Posted : 12/16/2018 3:52:24 PM
So, to continue (I had to go out before I could finish typing all of the relevant paragraphs):
Quote:
[...]The structure of harmine was also known [Perkin & Robinson 1919a, 1919b], and the alkaloid was first synthesized in 1927 [Manske et al. 1927; Späth & Lederer 1930a, 1930b]. Harmine was found to be 7-methoxy-1-methyl-β-carboline, sharing the β-carboline ring (a tricyclic indole nucleus known technically as pyrido[3,4-b]indole) with other alkaloids already known from Peganum harmala seeds, such as harmaline [Göbel 1841], harmalol [Fischer 1885, Göbel 1841],harmol, ruine, dihydroruine and leptaflorine or tetrahydroharmine (THH) [Allen & Holmstedt 1980]; some of which, as we will see, were later isolated also from Banisteriopsis species. Thus, by 1929 it was definitively demonstrated that the principle alkaloid of ayahuasca plants was harmine, a compound of known structure which had already been synthesized.


(Let me know if you'd like any the references.)




“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Aum_Shanti
#5 Posted : 12/17/2018 9:12:27 AM
Quote:
before I could finish typing all of the relevant paragraphs):


Typing?

Maybe you should look into an OCR.
I claim not that this is the truth. As this is just what got manifested into my mind at the current position in time on this physical plane. So please feel not offended by anything I say.
 
Th Entity
#6 Posted : 12/17/2018 7:37:36 PM
Hi Coma and welcome to the DMT-Nexus!

Maybe this wont help but oh well, one of the things about psychs and illegal substances in general is there is very litlle to no research and information. You can watch the Joe Rogan + Denis Mckenna podcast its long 2 + hours, at one point Mckenna talks about harmine(Telepathine) and i believe him and Nichols (plus few more people) more than anyone else when it comes to psychedelics.

Joe Rogan Experience - Denis Mckenna Podcast
The part about Maoi and Harmine is at 1:09:50. Thumbs up
 
downwardsfromzero
ModeratorChemical expert
#7 Posted : 12/17/2018 8:41:29 PM
Aum_Shanti wrote:
Typing?

Maybe you should look into an OCR.

IKR, but my current scanning set-up is suboptimal and I quite enjoyed the typing practice. That said, my USB microscope works reasonably well to photograph text so next time I'll probably do that, thinking about it.




“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
 
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