We've Moved! Visit our NEW FORUM to join the latest discussions. This is an archive of our previous conversations...

You can find the login page for the old forum here.
CHATPRIVACYDONATELOGINREGISTER
DMT-Nexus
FAQWIKIHEALTH & SAFETYARTATTITUDEACTIVE TOPICS
PREV12
Cancellation of World Debt. Options
 
SnozzleBerry
Moderator | Skills: Growing (plants/mushrooms), Research, Extraction troubleshooting, Harmalas, Revolution (theory/practice)
#21 Posted : 9/25/2011 4:06:39 PM
jdubs wrote:
No one is saying get rid of money. I think that if you cancelled debt ALL CITZENS OF THE WORLD WOULD BE ON AN EQUAL FOOTING FOR THE FIRST TIME SINCE THE CREATION OF MONEY.

What about all the houses/cars/buildings technology that exist solely because of debt? You're seriously saying if those are still in the hands of debtors, everyone's at square 1? Come on now...
WikiAttitudeFAQ
The NexianNexus ResearchThe OHT
In New York, we wrote the legal number on our arms in marker...To call a lawyer if we were arrested.
In Istanbul, People wrote their blood types on their arms. I hear in Egypt, They just write Their names.
גם זה יעבור
 
joedirt
Senior Member
#22 Posted : 9/25/2011 4:24:50 PM
Laban Shrewsbury III wrote:
lol. So much economics fail in here.

If all debt was for some inconceivable reason to be expunged, the global economy would be obliterated. That may sound cool if you're 10 years old and like the sound of living off squirrels in your treehouse, but the reality would be considerably less fun - think billions starving, unprecedented refugee migrations, the complete collapse of trading markets, then governments, and a halt to all industry and other forms of human activity on the planet not immediately concerned with personal survival. Nobody would have a job. All money would be meaningless, because money is a contextual symbol of value, and that context has just been eliminated.

So yeah, keep championing this lunacy if you consider the Stone Age preferable to modern complexities, and would rather humanity just continued to be mired in suffering rather than actually sort our problems out like adults.



I can pretty much guarantee you that the planet earth would much rather us humans go back to the stone age.

The question is this: Will we develop technology fast enough to not destroy our resources? if not then the planet will win and we will take a trip back to the stone ages..wether we like it or not. All the debt in the world won't produce more oil than exists. All the debt in the world won't produce more fertilizer once we've depleted the phosphorus mines. All the debt and money will be meaningless if don't find someone to tie our economy to natural resources usage.

History proves that 100% of the time a country tries to develop a fiat currency that country fails. We...and every other fiat currency on the planet will fail. It's really only a matter of time IMHO.
If your religion, faith, devotion, or self proclaimed spirituality is not directly leading to an increase in kindness, empathy, compassion and tolerance for others then you have been misled.
 
SnozzleBerry
Moderator | Skills: Growing (plants/mushrooms), Research, Extraction troubleshooting, Harmalas, Revolution (theory/practice)
#23 Posted : 9/25/2011 6:09:31 PM
It's more than that, though...it's also "will developing our technology destroy our resources/environment?" You can't make many things without minerals mined from "third-world" nations, which has a direct impact on both the ecology and societies of that region.
WikiAttitudeFAQ
The NexianNexus ResearchThe OHT
In New York, we wrote the legal number on our arms in marker...To call a lawyer if we were arrested.
In Istanbul, People wrote their blood types on their arms. I hear in Egypt, They just write Their names.
גם זה יעבור
 
corpus callosum
Medical DoctorModerator
#24 Posted : 9/25/2011 6:36:47 PM
I think 'conventional' economics is, at its very heart, iniquitous and panders to humans' desires for acquisition of whatevers going.As things stand,IMO, cancelling all world debt ,both national/international and personal, would as Laban has said, cause untold mayhem.

I think, and this has been raised in threads before this, its how the debts are allowed to generate which is the problem ie the 'creation' of money from effectively nothing of substance and then the allowing of this to le loaned at interest which is the essence of the problem.Couple this with the so-called 'structural reforms' which the loans are made conditional upon (and the example of Northern Ethiopia exporting grain whilst its Southerners were starving in the era of Live Aid/Band Aid of the 80s springs to mind) which is effectively the fear of the creditors of not reaping theie obscene profit at a tragically high cost to the citizens of the debtor nations.

Its a fascinating but ultimately depressing pit we find ourselves in ,and we as individuals are also no innocent bystanders.We want things NOW, the credit to get them is (or was) easy and was easier to get hold of than a decent strip of acid (well for me anyway) and did become culturally 'normal'.Until not so long ago a marker of ones 'worth' in society was how much credit one was able to get, and most people fed into this without realising that this fallacy called misnamed 'credit' had to be honoured irrespective of the vicissitudes our lives' paths may take.


Usurious practices, a lassiez fair attitude by us when it serves our oft-times unrequired 'needs' and human nature-these, I reckon, are to blame.
I am paranoid of my brain. It thinks all the time, even when I'm asleep. My thoughts assail me. Murderous lechers they are. Thought is the assassin of thought. Like a man stabbing himself with one hand while the other hand tries to stop the blade. Like an explosion that destroys the detonator. I am paranoid of my brain. It makes me unsettled and ill at ease. Makes me chase my tail, freezes my eyes and shuts me down. Watches me. Eats my head. It destroys me.

 
The Day Tripper
#25 Posted : 9/25/2011 7:02:11 PM
Whats to stop those who have money/resources after the cancellation from lending it to those who do not have it? That's a basic principle necessary for economies of goods. Been going on far longer than money imo. Would this somehow be made illegal?

Its not a simple problem that can be solved by cancellation of the worlds debt. Independently reviewing and overhauling the monetary system,determining conflicts of interest in government/industry, handling the national debt in a responsible manner, and a major housecleaning in our legal code could do wonders for this country. But that all requires independent reasoned analysis of the current system, and thats just not possible the way things are set up now a days.

Yes, money is debt, as long as someone is getting paid for making and passing it off as value. And fractional reserve banking is a major problem with our monetary siystem. But the debt immorally imposed upon people today, is the result of corporate manipulation of governments all over the world. Its more of a bilderberg strongman trying to amass the worlds wealth/resources. With this process, many are screwed over (especially us taxpayers) by debt, and price manipulation, etc. Thats the real problem. It is the banks and the way they lend money, but its also soo much more, the core of witch spawned all this bullshit, and you have to purge that out before things can get better. What i'm talking about of course is special interests manipulating the government process to gain financially. That is the heart of darkness.
"let those who have talked to the elves, find each other and band together" -TMK

In a society in which nearly everybody is dominated by somebody else's mind or by a disembodied mind, it becomes increasingly difficult to learn the truth about the activities of governments and corporations, about the quality or value of products, or about the health of one's own place and economy.
In such a society, also, our private economies will depend less upon the private ownership of real, usable property, and more upon property that is institutional and abstract, beyond individual control, such as money, insurance policies, certificates of deposit, stocks, etc. And as our private economies become more abstract, the mutual, free helps and pleasures of family and community life will be supplanted by a kind of displaced citizenship and by commerce with impersonal and self-interested suppliers...
The great enemy of freedom is the alignment of political power with wealth. This alignment destroys the commonwealth - that is, the natural wealth of localities and the local economies of household, neighborhood, and community - and so destroys democracy, of which the commonwealth is the foundation and practical means.” - Wendell Berry
 
Spock's Brain
#26 Posted : 9/25/2011 11:18:33 PM
Economic lesson in comic book form: http://www.takelifeback.com/hegawid/

"Infinite Diversity, in Infinite Combinations."
 
Laban Shrewsbury III
#27 Posted : 9/25/2011 11:50:46 PM
Spock's Brain wrote:
Economic lesson in comic book form: http://www.takelifeback.com/hegawid/



p.24 is where theory and practice part ways...

"I DENY your loan, which will only benefit me and be an economic burden to you!"

I don't think that sentence has been said by one single banker or politician in the past 15 years.
Sometimes I believe that this less material life is our truer life, and that our vain presence on the terraqueous globe is itself the secondary or merely virtual phenomenon.
 
PREV12
 
Users browsing this forum
Guest

DMT-Nexus theme created by The Traveler
This page was generated in 0.026 seconds.