why are you buying your piracetam online? do they sell it in capsules at most standard US drug stores?

As far as I know no local drug store sells piracetam. I am not sure why. You can order it online off amazon.com I buy the 1 fast 400 brand. It comes in a bulk powder so you need to capsule it yourself if you want it in that form which you can buy a capsule machine and geletin capsules also off amazon for around 30.00 The piracetam costs about 25ish dollars for a bulk conatiner. Depending on how much / often you use it that would last you 6months to a year. The choline is what's going to be expensive depending on the kind you use and it wont be that much really.

thanks! choline essentially just helps to enhance the effects of the piracetum correct? therefore, shouldn't the piracetum be beneficial on its own if necessary (for budget reasons) without the choline?

If you use lecithin as a choline source then it's really cheap too. In The Netherlands you can get 300g for less then 3 euro's and thats good for a whole month.

I'm currently studying choline a bit. It's a precursor for acetylcholine (together with acetyl-CoA), a very important neurotransmitter. Choline on itself can't cross the blood-brain barrier, it needs a transporter to do this.

From this site I got some interesting info:


So apart from choline you also need choline transporters (CHTs) like SLC5A7. I'm not sure if this quote states that this transporter is abundantly available or not. You would think so since it's the choline that's running out quickly when taking nootropics but it's still one to watch, maybe it's next in line to get out of stock.


UPDATE: After some further research I've found something very interesting. There is a substance called Alpha-GPC.

And here's the kicker:


There are very interesting reads all over the internet to find. I just found a dutch site with seems to have good information about memory loss and how to prevent it, it lists many substances to read about (too many to just list here). I'll read into it and post about it later on.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

great find, traveler. I forgot about that one (i obviously don't have any hehe)
yep, with alpha-gpc and aniracetam, you'd likely feel tip-top

Alpha GPC is what I am using now. You need some sort of choline as piracetam metabolizes choline to get it's effects. Unless your taking in allot fo choline from food or you are only using piracetam like once a week or less your gonna need to suppliment it.

So if my slow brain (which is in dire need of smart drugs ) is getting all this correctly, then it sounds like I need:

1. piracetum which in laymans terms somehow manages to help our brains to function more efficiently.
2. choline as piracetam must metabolize choline in order to work effectively.
3. Alpha GPC since it helps transport the choline to the brain where it is hopefully metabolized by piracetum.

Do I have this right or are Alpha GPC and choline redundant? It sounds like finding the right dosages of each is somewhat trial and error. Also, were does one get Alpha GPC online?

You need one choline source. Alpha-GPC is one, Lecithin is another. Alpha GPC is said to be the best and most expensive, Lecithin the worst and cheapest.

this is a great thread to find. I have just been thinking about researching and purchasing some more nootropics over the past few day.

ok so I dont have much experience with any of the nootropics other than piracetam but I have been taking it for about 6 months now and have had some very positive effects.

I bought bulk 1fast400 piracetam and choline citrate. I am just about to run out of piracetam and have most of the choline citrate left. I definitely noticed the effect on my mental clarity, creativity and memory when I first started taking piracetam. There were noticeable diminished effects after the first few days. I began with a large 'attack dose' of 2400mg of piracetam and 250-500mg of choline piracetam 4 times per day. To me this seemed like a huge amount to consume but the package recommends 3-4 servings 2400mg per day. I reduced my attack dose to 1-2 x 2400mg piracetam and 1 x 500mg after the first few days. I do not take it everyday. I usually have at least 3 days off per week sometimes more. The effects are definitely more noticeable after a break.

I must admit that although in the beginning I was very impressed with the positive effects I now really only notice very subtle effects. However my close friends have said that they do notice a noticeble shift in my intelect and mood when I do take piracetam.

I am also going to try some of the other racetams very shortly and will post some results here.

Considering that piracetam has been around for quite a long time I would be interested to know if there are any new nootropics with similar benefits?

im looking forward to seeing the information this thread collects

You can get several diffrent varieties of choline like DMAE and alpha gpc at a chain called the vitamin shoppe. Other stores of the like might have it too. The store I went to kept the GPC behind the counter for some odd reason so you might have to ask for it.

Getting the dosage down right is a very difficult task at least for me atm. I am still having issues with it and I dont now if there is a right dosage as I have yet to hit on anything that would give me the original effect and I have tried just about every last premutation possible.

i can vouch for dmae. i used to take it back in '98, '99.
it tends to clear the mental fog caused by excessive pot smoking (then again, so does piracetam). twin lab makes the liquid form, with paba

I started to look into these things around that time, mostly from hyperreal's nootropic archive, and hedweb


some notable ones:
piracetam (already mentioned here)
hydergine (LSD's brainy cousin)
huperzine-a
acetyl-l-carnitine
vinpocetine
vasopressin/oxytocin
rasagiline
l-deprenyl


here's a decent site for reference http://www.antiaging-systems.com/
though you can find those products cheaper elsewhere

so it sounds like the long turn benefits, if there are any, of piracetam are very questionable...

Has anyone find piracetam in capsule form online? I would almost prefer to pay a bit more to already have it in capsules. I found alpha GPC on amazon:

Alpha GBC link

more like acetylcholine.

dreams are like the mind in defrag mode, sorting through memories...with some visual cortex stimulation to boot.

piracetam is water soluble, and passes through unchanged.
you need to maintain it daily. combined with actual problem-solving thinking, it's like body-building for the mind.

aniracetam is lipophilic, so it readily passes the blood brain barrier. like piracetam, it enhances cross-hemisphere communication, though it's about 5 times as potent. the downside is its half-life: 2-3 hrs vs. 5-6 for piracetam




American Nutrition

thanks benzyme. I will probably try the capsules first and if I see success will then order bulk powder...

Also, sorry if I missed it somewhere in this thread but approximately how much Alpha GPC should one take in relation to piracetam? is it somewhere in the ballpark of 300mg of GPC to 1000mg of piracetam?

And I notice that 1fast400 has an Alpha GPC product but it says its 50%. What does that signify? I don't see any notation of 50% on the other alpha GPC products that I'm finding.

So many questions!

Nicely put into words The Logos,

On this moment, after taking herbs two days in a row I'm having compulsive thoughts about music when I'm not busy programming. My mind races off and it feels like I'm a kid again with these uncontrolled thoughts.

On this third day I'm only taking half the dosage to give my brain some respite.

I've read somewhere that piracetam has proven to be effective; it enhances cognitive functioning to such a degree that it's objectively measureable. BUT, that piracetam users don't always notice the enhancing effects as much as with some other substances that might be less effective. Or to put it in other words: whether you FEEL, it has beneficial effects is not an objective criterium for how effective a substance realy is.

I also read somewhere that LSD in very low doses can have nootropic effects simmilar to those of hydergine. This makes me worry about it's health effects in psychedelic amounts, since from hydergine it's known that it has an optimal 'peak-dose'; there is a dose that has optimal effects and when this dose is surpassed every extra amount lessens the optimal effect, so a very high dose of hydergine does the opposite of what a low, optimal dose of hydergine does; instead of protecting the brain against oxidative stress, the brain might become more exposed to it. If LSD would have a hydergine effect at low doses, could it be harmfull in psychedelic doses?

LSD significantly boosts creativity if you have the discipline to control yourself enough to actually do something while on it. Usually low dosages are easiest. Piracetam works, it is very noticeable in it's effectiveness. The issue is that once I got the initial effects from the forst times I took it I was unable to get effects as strong as those thereafter. While even when it's working at 60% it's still outstanding I would have loved to find the full beneficial balance.

you say that in the past tense. Are you going to discontinue the use of piracetam vovin? what is the ratio of choline (alpha gpc) to piracetam that one should take from your experience?

I havent stopped taking it. I didnt mean to insinuate that. Currently I am at 1200 pircetam and 600mg alpha-gpc twice a day. This is about the best results I can get atm.